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@[email protected] ♫ "Bad Guy" by Billie #Eilish #NowPlaying
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@futureisfoss @trom As this comment is lengthy, I'll offer first this concise version of what it covers and deals with (more thorough statement beginning at "LONG FORM COMMENT" below):
1. Why I equated "Economics" to both "Energy Exchange" AND "Trade" as synonymous terms
2. What I meant by "Energy" (and might as well call EVERYTHING "energy")
3. Nothing you're saying makes sense to me about "Trade" in and of itself and even your own citation of what "trade" is professed that what you were saying only made sense within the limited subset of possible "Trade" forms that are of a centrally controlled trade nature (of which "money" just happens to be a subset of). In the context of EXCLUDING economics like "bartering", "gifting", "agorism", etc. yes, I totally see what you're talking about and agree such systems are "Slave Economics" by the very nature of their Central Control and Command being applied to a congregant obeying mass that is denied the ability of setting and/or carrying any meaningful "value" set of their own.
Apologize for the length, but eh, such can often be the natural result of real inquiry and discussion.
Can't say I have any real disagreement or issue with anything you've thus far stated other than semantics and a suggestion that you might want to reconsider how you're defining "trade" and "economics" simply to avoid what you mean falling into contradictions with itself when one approaches "economic theory" or it's subset of "monetary theory".
Discussions of this sort are important and I HIGHLY commend your (and the TROM teams) work. I certainly don't have all the answers and I'm really not sure there's any real "freedom" EVER possible from ANY central entity that claims to. However, without discussions like these beginning to take place, truly addressing the issues inherent to "Where are we?", "How did we get here?", and "What might we do moving forward?" aren't likely to be addressed or acted on in any meaningful way.
As the old saying goes.....
"Free your mind and your ass will follow"
-Parliament Funkadelic
LONG FORM COMMENT:"By trade I mean this en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trade - it is inside of a context, that of the human world invented fantasy called "economic". I am deeply confused by what you are saying with "energy exchange".
From your own offered definition:
"Trade involves the transfer of goods or services from one person or entity to another, often in exchange for money. Economists refer to a system or network that allows trade as a market."
and
"An early form of trade, the Gift economy, saw the exchange of goods and services without an explicit agreement for immediate or future rewards. A gift economy involves trading things without the use of money. Modern traders generally negotiate through a medium of exchange, such as money. As a result, buying can be separated from selling, or earning. The invention of money (and later of credit, paper money and non-physical money) greatly simplified and promoted trade. Trade between two traders is called bilateral trade, while trade involving more than two traders is called multilateral trade."
First, notice that your own citation notes that "Trade" is a "Superset" of "money". That is to say, "money"/"monetary economics" ALWAYS holds an emergent relation to trade but trade IS NOT emergent from or always in relation to "money". As per your own citations claim:
"Modern traders generally [BUT NOT ALWAYS] negotiate through a medium of exchange, such as money [MONEY BEING BUT ONE POSSIBLE MEDIUM OF TRADE]
and "traders generally negotiate through a medium of exchange [THIS IS ONLY GENERALLY], such as money [AGAIN, MONEY IS ONLY ONE POSSIBLE MEDIUM OF MEDIUMS]. As a result, buying can be separated from selling, or earning [THE ACTUAL REAL/TRUE ECONOMIC OCCURRENCE IS NEGOTIATED THROUGH ABSTRACTION, AN ACT OF PURE IMAGINATION]. The invention of money (and later of credit, paper money and non-physical money) greatly simplified and promoted trade. [SIMPLIFIED IN AS MUCH THAT "VALUE" IS ESTABLISHED VIA A CENTRAL ENTITY AS OPPOSED TO MULTIPLE ENTITIES; ENABLING A REFEREE/JUDGE FOR MORE STREAMLINED "PRICE DISCOVERY"]
*Bracketed items being editorial notes originating from myself as opposed to the original citation*
Moving on, take heed that per the standard physics model both a "good" itself as well as a "service" are inherently imbued with and constituted of "energy" as given by the Planck Constant.
"a fundamental physical constant denoted h, and is of fundamental importance in quantum mechanics. A photon's energy is equal to its frequency multiplied by the Planck constant. Due to mass–energy equivalence, the Planck constant also relates mass to frequency."
Going even more explicitly into the details of things, we then have "Energy"
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy
"energy is the quantitative property that must be transferred to a body or physical system to perform work on the body, or to heat it. Energy is a conserved quantity; the law of conservation of energy states that energy can be converted in form, but not created or destroyed." [NOTE THAT SUCH MEANS THAT IN MORE TRUE/NON-ABSTRACTED ECONOMICS THIS MEANS SOMETHING MUCH CLOSER TO MULTILATERAL EXCHANGE ALWAYS UNDERLIES THE TRUTH OF ANY ABSTRACTED ECONOMICS.... THINGS ALWAYS SUM TO ZERO!]
So this is why I noted "money" as always being a centrally controlled abstract as applied to a mass for "energy exchange" (aka "economics"). The "money" is simply a "debt instrument" used for establishing that some "value" of "energy" is owed/obligated to the holder of "money".
For Nation State "money", the "Boss Level" as it were, became the central bank(s). The Central Bank of Central Banks, "The Boss" of the "Boss Level" being the BIS (Bank of International Settlements). Below the BIS is then the World Bank and IMF. Below the World Bank and IMF are then what people popularly think of when they hear the words "central bank", that being things like the U.S. Federal Reserve, the UK Bank of England, Japan's Bank of Japan, China's People's Bank Of China, etc. Finally one reaches the level of things like the "Member Bank(s)", which is the level at which the general public starts interacting with the CENTRALLY CONTROLLED system. These are banks like Bank Of America, Wells Fargo, BBVA (now PNC). Note that in light of all surface level appearances of "decentralization", the system itself does centralize; the appearance of "decentralization" being born of a result of mistaking different divisions of the same network as being unique and totally independent of each other when that simply NEVER was the case.
Of note, the BIS resides in Basel, Switzerland. There's the old saying of "Be like the Swiss" with underlying comment to how Switzerland was "neutral" in World War II. It's pretty easy to remain neutral when one is "The Boss (level)",
As fore-noted, in lieu of the advent of HFT (High Frequency Trading) and the like, "value" management was (basically) handed over to "A.I.".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4nCTdQlH8w
If anything, the only roll left to the CBs (Central Banks) is one of providing "liquidity" to and for the "A.I." Such "liquidity" is made manifest through acts like "Quantitative Easing" (aka "Q.E."), which in a simple, just means "Creating new money out of thin air".
The CBs have then (made clear) that they are, for whatever reason, removing themselves from the system and basically turning over their role as a facilitator of Liquidity to the general mass. Which, in a simple, is opened up by allowing just about any and all to both
1. create money
djangostars.com/blog/how-to-bu…
AND
2. Removing the human entity from (virtually) having anything to do with monetary management and exchange rates.
www.fsf.org/bulletin/2020/fall…
As this process completes, the CBs have been rather blunt and clear, as per the Fed Chairman Jerome Powell last april...
"I'm in a position to guarantee that the Fed will do everything we can to support the economy for as long as it takes to complete the recovery."
*full interview here: www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minute… *
A sneaky way of basically saying "QE! QE FOREVER!" as that's literally about the only tool left in the CB bucket to "support the [monetary] economy". As any cessation of QE has been shown to both clearly and drastically manifest as (monetary) market shocks and downturns. Never mind "Melt Down", the (monetary) market "Melts Up" (destroying itself in the process).
In an absurd world, sometimes the largest truths are easily mistaken for comedy. Such said, President's Camacho's speech on modern economics is single handily one of the most clear and direct commentaries I've ever heard or seen.....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92XjLNhGVFY
*amended video of Camacho to help illustrate the TRUTH that underlays what may at first appear mere comedy. Take heed to the recent trillions (and a trillion means a million billion) injected into markets, the eviction stays (aka "rent forgiveness"), the government sending out of "free" money to both businesses and to lesser extent general citizens, and of course the advent of public "get rich quick" through things like the "Robin Hood" app platform and of course cryptocurrencies falling from the sky. Then ask yourself if what's being delivered by Camacho really comedy, or is it just that the truth itself really is that absurd.*
Enter the PO(o)R [aka "Proof Of Resource"], the increased implementation of physically monitored human actions [ala physical action tangible "service" as opposed to a "good"] as mining mechanisms as opposed to the POW (Proof Of Work) method of resolving hashes (for more detail see Microsoft Patent WO2020060606), and similar related derivatives such as "Real Asset NFTs".
It's ALL not only "Energy Exchange" management (the "banks" simply guiding the "currency"; perhaps better said as "current see"), but more specifically CENTRALLY CONTROLLED "Energy Exchange". As fore noted, "Economics" being at it's root nothing more than "Energy Exchange".
The old (monetary) system abstraction is updated and simplified via
1. Automated Management ("A.I."; derived from the collectively emergent moral ethic)
2. Everything and EVERYONE under the system is rendered into little more than a direct commodity of the system. To quote Mr. Schwab of the World Economic Forum "You will own nothing, and you will be happy."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9XeyBd_IuA
*"Valhalla Mr Beale" indeed*
Money, the game where even when you "win", you actually "lose".
YOU ARE THE PRODUCT (of the collectively emergent shadow) SELF
and
(CONGRATULATIONS, THE SYSTEM SAYS YOU HAVE VALUE!)
"In The Algos We Trust"
Finally, all the Keynesian nonsense resolves to a balanced Zero sum game.....
that is, a zero sum game of death (as all individualized independent thought and action dynamics are literally eliminated and killed off and converted into essentially a centrally controlled "Hive Mind".... Star Treks "Borg" comes to mind).
Capitalism reaches it's final stage monopoly, in doing so it realizes both the Corp State driven dream of Mussolini's Fascism, Hitler's National Socialism, AND (Marx/Engles) dream of Communism. All said things were little more than the same "monetary economics" and as such all carried the same "monetary economics" end place dressed in different clothes for different audiences for purposes of #AreYouNotEntertained (Please click subscribe, like, and stay engaged)
Again, Google and Apple themselves covered this (to little public fan fare) in the public open a couple years ago now and for whatever disagreements I may hold with such institutions, I commend them on their public clarity of statement.
archive.org/details/GooglesThe…
There's an (educational) game called Paper Clips.... it's a rather witty and fun expose on the workings of "monetary economics", I HIGHLY recommend checking out. I'll give a spoiler though on that one doesn't win the game until not just everyone, but literally everything, has been turned into a commodity.
www.decisionproblem.com/paperc…
#BeExcellentToEachOther (because might as well)
#MoneyIsDead (Pandora's Box was opened and RoboCthulhu will devour all in it's path!)
and #OllieCthulu (because RoboCthulhu gives ZERO fuks who or what's in it's way and there's no more getting rid of RoboCthulhu then there is getting rid of your own shadow.... so just see and recognize Cthulhu, ollie Cthulhu, but probably no need to stress trying to overly engage Cthulhu in a fight because such is just an exercise in futility) -
@PublicNuisance @lps @futureisfoss @trom They aren't different from "money", however, they have "evolved" (if one might say that) "money" to acting more in the form of a Hidden Google of sorts.
"Old Money" necessitated more human interaction.... be that central bankers or what have you. "New Money" is more prone to just allow anyone to be their own central bank and even currency exchange.
It's like Google allowing (just about) anyone to create their own YouTube channel..... the player gets the "feeling" of liberty, choice, and control, even though ultimately it's Google calling all the shots on how the material they're given is handled. The advent of skript kiddies and "A.I." turned the monetary game into something more reflective of the Google->Youtube->User model.....
Personally, I refer to it as "In The Algos We Trust" (never mind "God")
One thing I find highly interesting about the "In The Algos We Trust" model is that at it's worst, it just results in a something like a collectively emergent "shadow self" and reflection. There's such huge swaths of data involved that one has to get "A.I." (or something equally capable) crunching on the numbers just to even hope to make meaningful relevance of what's going on.
So huge swaths of everything from Behavioral Analytics of individuals to Protein folding on to money itself, this persistent trust is placed into the Algo to make relevance of the data, present the data, and even act on the data in a sensible and meaningful way. Doesn't matter if one is dealing with Facebook, Wallstreet, Cryptocurrencies, or the administrators of China, all of them ultimately are caught in a stream of "What'd the Algo say the values were?"
But it's not just Enterprise, it's also the general public that is actively involved in not only creating the A.I., but makes personal choice to pay attention to any given "value" set it offers. The collective consensus comes from the collective moral ethic.
Personally, I welcome the high tech calculator automated entourage, what I don't welcome is worshiping it as a God.... that is to say, doing things like looking towards it for moral and ethical value and guidance.
But eh, the Pandora's Box of A.I. was opened, let loose on the money, and that's that. There's no putting "RoboCthulhu" back in the box.
So money is dead, LONG LIVE ROBOCTHULHU!
(not that RoboCthulhu is "alive" exactly)
Why this isn't discussed more openly when it's actions are publicly overt and have been so for years I have no idea. #AreYouNotEntertained I guess. Whatever the case, not exactly a fan of the G-Men, but they did well in just pretty blatantly and overtly telling the public, "WE ARE HERE!" when they (and Apple) rolled out "The Selfish Ledger" video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=https
But google and apple are far from alone.....
As the money was ran into complete absurdity so was the global politics that adhered to it. Just about anywhere one looks in the world connected to "monetary" value the joke just dances around to be seen at this point. Trillions of trades per second going on due to HFT (aka "A.I."), there's not a person around that can sort that all out, but eh, the algos say a BitCoin that takes over an hour and a half to even complete an exchange is worth $40,000 and "In The Algos We Trust"
(again, comedy show, any money that takes an hour and half just so a transaction can complete is so utterly broke it's laughable.... just because it's broke don't mean it's not flush in cash. It's a comedy script.... a Killing Joke) -
Imagine your child has never tasted an egg or seen a banana…
And is terrified of every sound, because the sounds of war taught their little heart that safety is just an illusion.
The war may have ended, but our suffering has not.
It destroyed our home and left us with fear, hunger, and cold.
My two children wake up scared, hiding from the wind, shivering inside a torn tent.
I’m no longer asking for much — just some warmth to ease their pain, and a glimpse of hope to bring back their childhood.
Be that hope. Support us with whatever you can.
https://gofund.me/8e33c20e
May God bless you.
@SolenedeM @jonesmurphy @chielk @Martranslations @futureisfoss @Tooden @sagilca
@palestine
#gaza #palstain#FreePalestine #FreeGaza #Genocide #StopGenocide #Boycott #BDS #BoycottIsrael
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Explaining the Most Important Artemis II Photos
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Do you want to have your own #Mastodon instance? How about #Peertube, #Nextcloud, #Matrix or a #Pixelfed instance? You can buy a managed hosting of these services from https://webape.site/
#ManagedHosting means you don't need to have any technical skills or know how to maintain a Linux server, all of that will be done for you. The #Webape project is a small business run by @tio, he also made https://trom.tf and have been providing all of those #FOSS services for free since 2021.
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Do you want to have your own #Mastodon instance? How about #Peertube, #Nextcloud, #Matrix or a #Pixelfed instance? You can buy a managed hosting of these services from https://webape.site/
#ManagedHosting means you don't need to have any technical skills or know how to maintain a Linux server, all of that will be done for you. The #Webape project is a small business run by @tio, he also made https://trom.tf and have been providing all of those #FOSS services for free since 2021.
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Do you want to have your own #Mastodon instance? How about #Peertube, #Nextcloud, #Matrix or a #Pixelfed instance? You can buy a managed hosting of these services from https://webape.site/
#ManagedHosting means you don't need to have any technical skills or know how to maintain a Linux server, all of that will be done for you. The #Webape project is a small business run by @tio, he also made https://trom.tf and have been providing all of those #FOSS services for free since 2021.
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Do you want to have your own #Mastodon instance? How about #Peertube, #Nextcloud, #Matrix or a #Pixelfed instance? You can buy a managed hosting of these services from https://webape.site/
#ManagedHosting means you don't need to have any technical skills or know how to maintain a Linux server, all of that will be done for you. The #Webape project is a small business run by @tio, he also made https://trom.tf and have been providing all of those #FOSS services for free since 2021.
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Do you want to have your own #Mastodon instance? How about #Peertube, #Nextcloud, #Matrix or a #Pixelfed instance? You can buy a managed hosting of these services from https://webape.site/
#ManagedHosting means you don't need to have any technical skills or know how to maintain a Linux server, all of that will be done for you. The #Webape project is a small business run by @tio, he also made https://trom.tf and have been providing all of those #FOSS services for free since 2021.
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Discussing Pseudoscience With Archeologist Flint Dibble
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRIYhWl01rE
I don't know what happened but pseudoscience and conspiracy theories started spreading like wildfire ever since the covid-19 pandemic. Fighting all of that misinformation online is not easy work, but thanks to people like this who take their time and effort to do so. Not all heroes wear capes!
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I've been using the #Metrolist app for some time now, nice to see their new wrapped feature.
So apparently in 2025 I spent 2563 minutes listening to music, where I listened to 293 unique songs, 251 unique albums and 189 unique artists! 🙂
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I still find it crazy that we have cables running along the ocean floor connecting the entire world across continents, absolutely insane story!
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Why we need to return Martian rock samples to Earth to test for signs of life
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tI9jiMUoXb4
This video turned out to be more interesting than I thought. And also kinda sad to see how current politics is negatively impacting science missions.
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This American Life - 865: The Other Territory
> Since October 7th, while the world has focused its attention on Gaza, the Israeli government has tightened the screws on the three million Palestinians in the West Bank in all sorts of dramatic ways. We travel to the West Bank to see these changes in person.
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Is water wet?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w3ct5rjk
> The wetness of water seems obvious - but dive into the science and it's not so clear cut. We take a closer look at what wetness really is.
Answering this question turned out to be more interesting than I thought.
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They Didn't Make Dire Wolves, They Made Something…Else
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ar0zgedLyTw
I feel like this video is an important one to share. I'm glad he also shed some light on the importance of publicly funded research, people don't seem to realize just how much of the science that comes out of private companies are built on studies from academia.
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How Does Television Stone Work?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1O56KD8nSvw
Its always fascinating to see these cool things existing in nature, all it takes is for a curious observer to stumble upon them to reveal something new about our world that we didn't know before.
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https://darknetdiaries.com/episode/139/
This is one of the craziest #hactivism stories I've ever heard! :ablobcatbongo:
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@tblock
Technology is a tool and its up to the people how they use it. Parents can use programs like #TBlock to protect their kids from harmful/malicious websites, but they can also use it to restrict/censor useful information and educational materials. All I can do is to hope that the parents are wise enough to know what's best for their kids.BTW, there are even some contries that block these websites, so its good to have tools like #Tor to circumvent this censorship.
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Agreed, people should be contributing to @openstreetmap instead of #GoogleMap !
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3ct3j6y
I really enjoyed this podcast episode because I've actually pondered about this question myself before, just like the 11 year old who called in and asked them. Considering the wide range of activities we humans can do just with the energy we get from our daily meals, it really makes you wonder how efficient we are as a species, compared to machines, other animals, etc.
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CW: More Twitter Randomness
> It's not like we're sitting here saying, "Welcome to #Fosstodon! Here your posts are called #Kevs!"
@kev LMAO 🤣
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@[email protected]
True, backups are important. One of the main reason people use cloud services is cause they think their data is safer on the cloud than their local computers.And its good to hear you do regular backups at trom.
I know that providers like #disroot, #snopyta, #nixnet etc. don't provide bitwarden, despite the fact that password management is very important. So I always assumed this was the reason behind it, that was my best guess.
@alex -
CW: More Twitter Randomness
> It's not like we're sitting here saying, "Welcome to #Fosstodon! Here your posts are called #Kevs!"
@kev LMAO 🤣
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CW: More Twitter Randomness
> It's not like we're sitting here saying, "Welcome to #Fosstodon! Here your posts are called #Kevs!"
@kev LMAO 🤣
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CW: More Twitter Randomness
> It's not like we're sitting here saying, "Welcome to #Fosstodon! Here your posts are called #Kevs!"
@kev LMAO 🤣
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CW: More Twitter Randomness
> It's not like we're sitting here saying, "Welcome to #Fosstodon! Here your posts are called #Kevs!"
@kev LMAO 🤣