#fediversemeta — Public Fediverse posts

@Frank Paul Silye Some have switched to self-hosted lightweight microblogging applications such as GoToSocial or snac.

Some have upgraded to something like Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Firefish, Iceshrimp or Sharkey. A few have even taken the big step up to Friendica or even Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte.

And then there are those who have left the Fediverse altogether and moved to the ATmosphere, mostly Bluesky.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #GoToSocial #snac #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #Sharkey #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #ATmosphere #Bluesky

@Frank Paul Silye Some have switched to self-hosted lightweight microblogging applications such as GoToSocial or snac.

Some have upgraded to something like Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Firefish, Iceshrimp or Sharkey. A few have even taken the big step up to Friendica or even Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte.

And then there are those who have left the Fediverse altogether and moved to the ATmosphere, mostly Bluesky.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #GoToSocial #snac #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #Sharkey #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #ATmosphere #Bluesky

@Frank Paul Silye Some have switched to self-hosted lightweight microblogging applications such as GoToSocial or snac.

Some have upgraded to something like Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Firefish, Iceshrimp or Sharkey. A few have even taken the big step up to Friendica or even Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte.

And then there are those who have left the Fediverse altogether and moved to the ATmosphere, mostly Bluesky.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #GoToSocial #snac #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #Sharkey #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #ATmosphere #Bluesky

@Frank Paul Silye Some have switched to self-hosted lightweight microblogging applications such as GoToSocial or snac.

Some have upgraded to something like Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Firefish, Iceshrimp or Sharkey. A few have even taken the big step up to Friendica or even Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte.

And then there are those who have left the Fediverse altogether and moved to the ATmosphere, mostly Bluesky.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #GoToSocial #snac #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #Sharkey #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #ATmosphere #Bluesky

@Frank Paul Silye Some have switched to self-hosted lightweight microblogging applications such as GoToSocial or snac.

Some have upgraded to something like Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Firefish, Iceshrimp or Sharkey. A few have even taken the big step up to Friendica or even Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte.

And then there are those who have left the Fediverse altogether and moved to the ATmosphere, mostly Bluesky.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #GoToSocial #snac #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #Sharkey #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #ATmosphere #Bluesky

@fedi (ツ) Es soll nur "sehr große Online-Plattformen" (VLOPs) und "sehr große Online-Suchmaschinen" (VLOSEs) betreffen. Also in Größenordnungen von zig Millionen monatlich aktiven Usern.

https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/policies/list-designated-vlops-and-vloses

Selbst wenn das Fediverse als Ganzes als eine zusammenhängende Plattform angesehen wird, kommt es nicht annähernd in diese Dimensionen.

Und das Fediverse wird nicht als Ganzes als eine zusammenhängende Plattform angesehen. Das geht gar nicht, und das wird auch die EU-Kommission begreifen. Denn es gibt niemanden, der zentral für das ganze Fediverse verantwortlich ist. Das Fediverse hat nicht eine ladungsfähige Adresse, sondern zigtausende.

Wir reden hier eher über weit über 45.000 Einzel-"Plattformen". Zugegeben, davon kann man diejenigen Anwendungen abziehen, die eh nur Einzelnutzeranwendungen sind, wie die gut 10.000 Ghost-Instanzen. Die EU-Kommission müßte trotzdem jeden verbleibenden Server einzeln überprüfen und jeden Serverbetreiber einzeln juristisch zur Rechenschaft ziehen.

Selbst mastodon.social ist mit gut 720.000 monatlich aktiven Usern weit davon entfernt, eine VLOP zu sein, und winzige Server kaum bekannter Fediverse-Anwendungen erst recht.

Die EU-Kommission wird kein Riesenfaß aufmachen, weil ein öffentlicher Forte-Server mit Freizeitadmin und fünf monatlich aktiven Usern keine wirksame Alterskontrolle hat. Das Resultat, wenn es denn eins gibt, rechtfertigt den bürokratischen, juristischen und letztlich monetären Aufwand nicht.

Man muß sich einfach mal überlegen: Wieviel Aufwand ist es für die EU, eine "Online-Plattform" wegen unzureichender oder fehlender Alterskontrolle zur Rechenschaft zu ziehen? Wie lange dauert das, was bindet das an Personal, was kostet das?

So, und selbst wenn wir im Fediverse nur Server mit mindestens zehn aktiven Usern pro Monat betrachten, überlegen wir uns mal, was es für ein Aufwand wäre, das gut 3.600x zu machen. Wenn wir jeden Server jeder Software betrachten, die mehrere User auf einem Server ermöglicht (also auch WordPress, wo die Mehrzahl der Instanzen Einzelblogs sind, aber öffentliche Bloggingserver technisch möglich sind), sind wir weit im fünfstelligen Bereich.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #KidsAct

@fedi (ツ) Es soll nur "sehr große Online-Plattformen" (VLOPs) und "sehr große Online-Suchmaschinen" (VLOSEs) betreffen. Also in Größenordnungen von zig Millionen monatlich aktiven Usern.

https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/policies/list-designated-vlops-and-vloses

Selbst wenn das Fediverse als Ganzes als eine zusammenhängende Plattform angesehen wird, kommt es nicht annähernd in diese Dimensionen.

Und das Fediverse wird nicht als Ganzes als eine zusammenhängende Plattform angesehen. Das geht gar nicht, und das wird auch die EU-Kommission begreifen. Denn es gibt niemanden, der zentral für das ganze Fediverse verantwortlich ist. Das Fediverse hat nicht eine ladungsfähige Adresse, sondern zigtausende.

Wir reden hier eher über weit über 45.000 Einzel-"Plattformen". Zugegeben, davon kann man diejenigen Anwendungen abziehen, die eh nur Einzelnutzeranwendungen sind, wie die gut 10.000 Ghost-Instanzen. Die EU-Kommission müßte trotzdem jeden verbleibenden Server einzeln überprüfen und jeden Serverbetreiber einzeln juristisch zur Rechenschaft ziehen.

Selbst mastodon.social ist mit gut 720.000 monatlich aktiven Usern weit davon entfernt, eine VLOP zu sein, und winzige Server kaum bekannter Fediverse-Anwendungen erst recht.

Die EU-Kommission wird kein Riesenfaß aufmachen, weil ein öffentlicher Forte-Server mit Freizeitadmin und fünf monatlich aktiven Usern keine wirksame Alterskontrolle hat. Das Resultat, wenn es denn eins gibt, rechtfertigt den bürokratischen, juristischen und letztlich monetären Aufwand nicht.

Man muß sich einfach mal überlegen: Wieviel Aufwand ist es für die EU, eine "Online-Plattform" wegen unzureichender oder fehlender Alterskontrolle zur Rechenschaft zu ziehen? Wie lange dauert das, was bindet das an Personal, was kostet das?

So, und selbst wenn wir im Fediverse nur Server mit mindestens zehn aktiven Usern pro Monat betrachten, überlegen wir uns mal, was es für ein Aufwand wäre, das gut 3.600x zu machen. Wenn wir jeden Server jeder Software betrachten, die mehrere User auf einem Server ermöglicht (also auch WordPress, wo die Mehrzahl der Instanzen Einzelblogs sind, aber öffentliche Bloggingserver technisch möglich sind), sind wir weit im fünfstelligen Bereich.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #KidsAct

@fedi (ツ) Es soll nur "sehr große Online-Plattformen" (VLOPs) und "sehr große Online-Suchmaschinen" (VLOSEs) betreffen. Also in Größenordnungen von zig Millionen monatlich aktiven Usern.

https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/policies/list-designated-vlops-and-vloses

Selbst wenn das Fediverse als Ganzes als eine zusammenhängende Plattform angesehen wird, kommt es nicht annähernd in diese Dimensionen.

Und das Fediverse wird nicht als Ganzes als eine zusammenhängende Plattform angesehen. Das geht gar nicht, und das wird auch die EU-Kommission begreifen. Denn es gibt niemanden, der zentral für das ganze Fediverse verantwortlich ist. Das Fediverse hat nicht eine ladungsfähige Adresse, sondern zigtausende.

Wir reden hier eher über weit über 45.000 Einzel-"Plattformen". Zugegeben, davon kann man diejenigen Anwendungen abziehen, die eh nur Einzelnutzeranwendungen sind, wie die gut 10.000 Ghost-Instanzen. Die EU-Kommission müßte trotzdem jeden verbleibenden Server einzeln überprüfen und jeden Serverbetreiber einzeln juristisch zur Rechenschaft ziehen.

Selbst mastodon.social ist mit gut 720.000 monatlich aktiven Usern weit davon entfernt, eine VLOP zu sein, und winzige Server kaum bekannter Fediverse-Anwendungen erst recht.

Die EU-Kommission wird kein Riesenfaß aufmachen, weil ein öffentlicher Forte-Server mit Freizeitadmin und fünf monatlich aktiven Usern keine wirksame Alterskontrolle hat. Das Resultat, wenn es denn eins gibt, rechtfertigt den bürokratischen, juristischen und letztlich monetären Aufwand nicht.

Man muß sich einfach mal überlegen: Wieviel Aufwand ist es für die EU, eine "Online-Plattform" wegen unzureichender oder fehlender Alterskontrolle zur Rechenschaft zu ziehen? Wie lange dauert das, was bindet das an Personal, was kostet das?

So, und selbst wenn wir im Fediverse nur Server mit mindestens zehn aktiven Usern pro Monat betrachten, überlegen wir uns mal, was es für ein Aufwand wäre, das gut 3.600x zu machen. Wenn wir jeden Server jeder Software betrachten, die mehrere User auf einem Server ermöglicht (also auch WordPress, wo die Mehrzahl der Instanzen Einzelblogs sind, aber öffentliche Bloggingserver technisch möglich sind), sind wir weit im fünfstelligen Bereich.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #KidsAct

@fedi (ツ) Es soll nur "sehr große Online-Plattformen" (VLOPs) und "sehr große Online-Suchmaschinen" (VLOSEs) betreffen. Also in Größenordnungen von zig Millionen monatlich aktiven Usern.

https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/policies/list-designated-vlops-and-vloses

Selbst wenn das Fediverse als Ganzes als eine zusammenhängende Plattform angesehen wird, kommt es nicht annähernd in diese Dimensionen.

Und das Fediverse wird nicht als Ganzes als eine zusammenhängende Plattform angesehen. Das geht gar nicht, und das wird auch die EU-Kommission begreifen. Denn es gibt niemanden, der zentral für das ganze Fediverse verantwortlich ist. Das Fediverse hat nicht eine ladungsfähige Adresse, sondern zigtausende.

Wir reden hier eher über weit über 45.000 Einzel-"Plattformen". Zugegeben, davon kann man diejenigen Anwendungen abziehen, die eh nur Einzelnutzeranwendungen sind, wie die gut 10.000 Ghost-Instanzen. Die EU-Kommission müßte trotzdem jeden verbleibenden Server einzeln überprüfen und jeden Serverbetreiber einzeln juristisch zur Rechenschaft ziehen.

Selbst mastodon.social ist mit gut 720.000 monatlich aktiven Usern weit davon entfernt, eine VLOP zu sein, und winzige Server kaum bekannter Fediverse-Anwendungen erst recht.

Die EU-Kommission wird kein Riesenfaß aufmachen, weil ein öffentlicher Forte-Server mit Freizeitadmin und fünf monatlich aktiven Usern keine wirksame Alterskontrolle hat. Das Resultat, wenn es denn eins gibt, rechtfertigt den bürokratischen, juristischen und letztlich monetären Aufwand nicht.

Man muß sich einfach mal überlegen: Wieviel Aufwand ist es für die EU, eine "Online-Plattform" wegen unzureichender oder fehlender Alterskontrolle zur Rechenschaft zu ziehen? Wie lange dauert das, was bindet das an Personal, was kostet das?

So, und selbst wenn wir im Fediverse nur Server mit mindestens zehn aktiven Usern pro Monat betrachten, überlegen wir uns mal, was es für ein Aufwand wäre, das gut 3.600x zu machen. Wenn wir jeden Server jeder Software betrachten, die mehrere User auf einem Server ermöglicht (also auch WordPress, wo die Mehrzahl der Instanzen Einzelblogs sind, aber öffentliche Bloggingserver technisch möglich sind), sind wir weit im fünfstelligen Bereich.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #KidsAct

@Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸 They don't.

First of all, that'd require searching the entire Fediverse for accounts and channels that have blocked you. Your Mastodon account has no records of who has blocked you, that's why searching is necessary.

Also, it'd require remotely re-writing the block settings on accounts and channels of every Fediverse software, from Mastodon to Hubzilla which works absolutely nothing like Mastodon internally.

Lastly, next to the huge effort, that'd simply be a stupid idea.

Even nomadic identity (https://joinfediverse.wiki/Nomadic_identity) doesn't provide this feature. That has to say something.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Hubzilla #NomadicIdentity #Block #BlockMeta #CWBlockMeta

@/dev/urandom This would actually be quite counter-productive if it was hard-coded, especially on Mastodon.

See, the Fediverse can create content that Mastodon can't even properly display. Or rather, stubbornly refuses to display because of its self-imposed limitations.

Commercial news platforms like Ghost and Flipboard, specialised long-form blogging applications like WordPress, WriteFreely and Plume, the "Facebook-style social networking" side in the shape of Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte, they can all send messages into the Fediverse that make use of all formatting tricks in the HTML book and then some. But if Mastodon, with whichever frontend, were to display them, it would often completely and utterly deface them.

Mastodon has no support for titles, at least not in messages which it actually displays. It pretends they don't exist.

Mastodon has no support for ordered lists with numbers or letters. It changes them into bullet-point lists.

Mastodon has no support for tables, for horizontal rules, for text colours, for text sizes except in headlines etc. It "sanitises" them into plain, unformatted text entirely.

Most importantly, Mastodon has no support for embedded images and for more than four images in one message.

For example, let's assume someone writes a beautiful travel blog post on WordPress with the ActivityPub add-on activated. The post has ten images embedded between paragraphs with the paragraphs referencing the images.

If Mastodon tried to render this blog post, it would rip all images out of the text where they should be embedded. If you're lucky, it would hang four of these images up underneath the post and silently discard the other six so you'll never know they exist. If you're unlucky, Mastodon would silently discard all ten images.

This, by the way, is the very reason that it's good that Mastodon usually "displays" such posts with their title, their summary and a link to the original that'll open at its source in your Web browser. It'll allow you to see the post as it was intended by the author. Mastodon itself won't.

At the very least, the links in such Mastodon-generated "previews" must continue to lead to their sources and open in a Web browser. The very reason why these "previews" exist is so that Mastodon can keep clinging to its purist microblogging principles while at the same time not defacing the posts which are "previewed" with links.

Also, there must always remain the option to look at messages at their source, and be it stashed away in a menu.

If you want all of this to disappear just so that phone users are spared from their browsers ever popping up whenever they tap something in their Mastodon apps, then you'll deprive the Mastodon users of any way of seeing anything in the Fediverse without Mastodon's limitations.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Flipboard #Ghost #WordPress #WriteFreely #Plume #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #TextFormatting #RichText

@/dev/urandom This would actually be quite counter-productive if it was hard-coded, especially on Mastodon.

See, the Fediverse can create content that Mastodon can't even properly display. Or rather, stubbornly refuses to display because of its self-imposed limitations.

Commercial news platforms like Ghost and Flipboard, specialised long-form blogging applications like WordPress, WriteFreely and Plume, the "Facebook-style social networking" side in the shape of Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte, they can all send messages into the Fediverse that make use of all formatting tricks in the HTML book and then some. But if Mastodon, with whichever frontend, were to display them, it would often completely and utterly deface them.

Mastodon has no support for titles, at least not in messages which it actually displays. It pretends they don't exist.

Mastodon has no support for ordered lists with numbers or letters. It changes them into bullet-point lists.

Mastodon has no support for tables, for horizontal rules, for text colours, for text sizes except in headlines etc. It "sanitises" them into plain, unformatted text entirely.

Most importantly, Mastodon has no support for embedded images and for more than four images in one message.

For example, let's assume someone writes a beautiful travel blog post on WordPress with the ActivityPub add-on activated. The post has ten images embedded between paragraphs with the paragraphs referencing the images.

If Mastodon tried to render this blog post, it would rip all images out of the text where they should be embedded. If you're lucky, it would hang four of these images up underneath the post and silently discard the other six so you'll never know they exist. If you're unlucky, Mastodon would silently discard all ten images.

This, by the way, is the very reason that it's good that Mastodon usually "displays" such posts with their title, their summary and a link to the original that'll open at its source in your Web browser. It'll allow you to see the post as it was intended by the author. Mastodon itself won't.

At the very least, the links in such Mastodon-generated "previews" must continue to lead to their sources and open in a Web browser. The very reason why these "previews" exist is so that Mastodon can keep clinging to its purist microblogging principles while at the same time not defacing the posts which are "previewed" with links.

Also, there must always remain the option to look at messages at their source, and be it stashed away in a menu.

If you want all of this to disappear just so that phone users are spared from their browsers ever popping up whenever they tap something in their Mastodon apps, then you'll deprive the Mastodon users of any way of seeing anything in the Fediverse without Mastodon's limitations.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Flipboard #Ghost #WordPress #WriteFreely #Plume #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #TextFormatting #RichText

@silverpill Who are the longformers anyway?

They're those who either are commercial or looking for professional/commercial users or both. Flipboard. Automattic (WordPress). Ghost. These kinds.

They know themselves. They know each other. And they know Mastodon. And that's it.

None of them has ever heard of Pleroma or Akkoma.

None of them has ever heard of Misskey or the Forkeys.

None of them has ever heard of Mitra.

None of them has ever heard of GoToSocial.

None of them has ever heard of Hollo.

None of them has ever heard of Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte, even though Friendica and Hubzilla are both older than Mastodon. And apparently, neither has @Helge. But then again, Friendica and its nomadic, security-enhanced descendants are being overlooked by almost everyone. That's why there's always on-going work for features to be "introduced to the Fediverse" which Friendica has had for a decade and a half.

Granted, the HTML support on Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte can be summarised with "yes". But elaborate tables that show what either of them supports how would be very useful.

Also, granted, everything I've mentioned above (normally) uses something else than HTML for formatting in the frontend. For example, Misskey and all Forkeys use MFM ("Misskey-Flavoured Markdown"). Friendica uses extended BBcode with the option to use Markdown instead. Hubzilla uses even more extended BBcode. (streams) and Forte can use the same even more extended BBcode and Markdown and HTML at the same time within the same post, although not all markup languages support all features.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Mitra #GoToSocial #Hollo #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #LongFormContent #BBcode #Markdown #HTML #TextFormatting

@silverpill Who are the longformers anyway?

They're those who either are commercial or looking for professional/commercial users or both. Flipboard. Automattic (WordPress). Ghost. These kinds.

They know themselves. They know each other. And they know Mastodon. And that's it.

None of them has ever heard of Pleroma or Akkoma.

None of them has ever heard of Misskey or the Forkeys.

None of them has ever heard of Mitra.

None of them has ever heard of GoToSocial.

None of them has ever heard of Hollo.

None of them has ever heard of Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte, even though Friendica and Hubzilla are both older than Mastodon. And apparently, neither has @Helge. But then again, Friendica and its nomadic, security-enhanced descendants are being overlooked by almost everyone. That's why there's always on-going work for features to be "introduced to the Fediverse" which Friendica has had for a decade and a half.

Granted, the HTML support on Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte can be summarised with "yes". But elaborate tables that show what either of them supports how would be very useful.

Also, granted, everything I've mentioned above (normally) uses something else than HTML for formatting in the frontend. For example, Misskey and all Forkeys use MFM ("Misskey-Flavoured Markdown"). Friendica uses extended BBcode with the option to use Markdown instead. Hubzilla uses even more extended BBcode. (streams) and Forte can use the same even more extended BBcode and Markdown and HTML at the same time within the same post, although not all markup languages support all features.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Mitra #GoToSocial #Hollo #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #LongFormContent #BBcode #Markdown #HTML #TextFormatting

@silverpill Who are the longformers anyway?

They're those who either are commercial or looking for professional/commercial users or both. Flipboard. Automattic (WordPress). Ghost. These kinds.

They know themselves. They know each other. And they know Mastodon. And that's it.

None of them has ever heard of Pleroma or Akkoma.

None of them has ever heard of Misskey or the Forkeys.

None of them has ever heard of Mitra.

None of them has ever heard of GoToSocial.

None of them has ever heard of Hollo.

None of them has ever heard of Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte, even though Friendica and Hubzilla are both older than Mastodon. And apparently, neither has @Helge. But then again, Friendica and its nomadic, security-enhanced descendants are being overlooked by almost everyone. That's why there's always on-going work for features to be "introduced to the Fediverse" which Friendica has had for a decade and a half.

Granted, the HTML support on Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte can be summarised with "yes". But elaborate tables that show what either of them supports how would be very useful.

Also, granted, everything I've mentioned above (normally) uses something else than HTML for formatting in the frontend. For example, Misskey and all Forkeys use MFM ("Misskey-Flavoured Markdown"). Friendica uses extended BBcode with the option to use Markdown instead. Hubzilla uses even more extended BBcode. (streams) and Forte can use the same even more extended BBcode and Markdown and HTML at the same time within the same post, although not all markup languages support all features.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Mitra #GoToSocial #Hollo #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #LongFormContent #BBcode #Markdown #HTML #TextFormatting

@silverpill Who are the longformers anyway?

They're those who either are commercial or looking for professional/commercial users or both. Flipboard. Automattic (WordPress). Ghost. These kinds.

They know themselves. They know each other. And they know Mastodon. And that's it.

None of them has ever heard of Pleroma or Akkoma.

None of them has ever heard of Misskey or the Forkeys.

None of them has ever heard of Mitra.

None of them has ever heard of GoToSocial.

None of them has ever heard of Hollo.

None of them has ever heard of Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte, even though Friendica and Hubzilla are both older than Mastodon. And apparently, neither has @Helge. But then again, Friendica and its nomadic, security-enhanced descendants are being overlooked by almost everyone. That's why there's always on-going work for features to be "introduced to the Fediverse" which Friendica has had for a decade and a half.

Granted, the HTML support on Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte can be summarised with "yes". But elaborate tables that show what either of them supports how would be very useful.

Also, granted, everything I've mentioned above (normally) uses something else than HTML for formatting in the frontend. For example, Misskey and all Forkeys use MFM ("Misskey-Flavoured Markdown"). Friendica uses extended BBcode with the option to use Markdown instead. Hubzilla uses even more extended BBcode. (streams) and Forte can use the same even more extended BBcode and Markdown and HTML at the same time within the same post, although not all markup languages support all features.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Mitra #GoToSocial #Hollo #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #LongFormContent #BBcode #Markdown #HTML #TextFormatting

@silverpill Who are the longformers anyway?

They're those who either are commercial or looking for professional/commercial users or both. Flipboard. Automattic (WordPress). Ghost. These kinds.

They know themselves. They know each other. And they know Mastodon. And that's it.

None of them has ever heard of Pleroma or Akkoma.

None of them has ever heard of Misskey or the Forkeys.

None of them has ever heard of Mitra.

None of them has ever heard of GoToSocial.

None of them has ever heard of Hollo.

None of them has ever heard of Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte, even though Friendica and Hubzilla are both older than Mastodon. And apparently, neither has @Helge. But then again, Friendica and its nomadic, security-enhanced descendants are being overlooked by almost everyone. That's why there's always on-going work for features to be "introduced to the Fediverse" which Friendica has had for a decade and a half.

Granted, the HTML support on Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte can be summarised with "yes". But elaborate tables that show what either of them supports how would be very useful.

Also, granted, everything I've mentioned above (normally) uses something else than HTML for formatting in the frontend. For example, Misskey and all Forkeys use MFM ("Misskey-Flavoured Markdown"). Friendica uses extended BBcode with the option to use Markdown instead. Hubzilla uses even more extended BBcode. (streams) and Forte can use the same even more extended BBcode and Markdown and HTML at the same time within the same post, although not all markup languages support all features.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Mitra #GoToSocial #Hollo #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #LongFormContent #BBcode #Markdown #HTML #TextFormatting

@Martin Holland Vanilla Mastodon cannot generate any text formatting in any shape or form AFAIK. You can be lucky that it can display a small subset of it, and even that has only been possible since October, 2022, when Mastodon 4 was released.

#FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #TextFormatting

@Martin Holland Vanilla Mastodon cannot generate any text formatting in any shape or form AFAIK. You can be lucky that it can display a small subset of it, and even that has only been possible since October, 2022, when Mastodon 4 was released.

#FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #TextFormatting

@Martin Holland Vanilla Mastodon cannot generate any text formatting in any shape or form AFAIK. You can be lucky that it can display a small subset of it, and even that has only been possible since October, 2022, when Mastodon 4 was released.

#FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #TextFormatting

@Martin Holland Vanilla Mastodon cannot generate any text formatting in any shape or form AFAIK. You can be lucky that it can display a small subset of it, and even that has only been possible since October, 2022, when Mastodon 4 was released.

#FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #TextFormatting

@Martin Holland Vanilla Mastodon cannot generate any text formatting in any shape or form AFAIK. You can be lucky that it can display a small subset of it, and even that has only been possible since October, 2022, when Mastodon 4 was released.

#FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #TextFormatting

@ᴚ uɐᗡ It's called a quote. Standard feature on Friendica, Hubzilla (where I am), (streams), the now-deceased rest of the family, Misskey and all its forks etc., basically everywhere that isn't Mastodon.

Within Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams), it's handled basically the same way as on good old bulletin-board forums: in BBcode.
[quote]if the process is really that involved and if they can fix it[/quote]

(streams) also has ways of doing that with Markdown or HTML.

There are various different ways of getting that code, also depending on whether one replies to a post or a comment.

ActivityPub uses Rich Text for formatting. So Friendica converts this into the corresponding formatting in Rich Text, and on Hubzilla and (streams), the optional ActivityPub bridge PubCrawl does that.

Mastodon, in turn, has introduced some Rich Text displaying capabilities with version 4.0.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #TextFormatting #BBcode #RichText

@ᴚ uɐᗡ It's called a quote. Standard feature on Friendica, Hubzilla (where I am), (streams), the now-deceased rest of the family, Misskey and all its forks etc., basically everywhere that isn't Mastodon.

Within Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams), it's handled basically the same way as on good old bulletin-board forums: in BBcode.
[quote]if the process is really that involved and if they can fix it[/quote]

(streams) also has ways of doing that with Markdown or HTML.

There are various different ways of getting that code, also depending on whether one replies to a post or a comment.

ActivityPub uses Rich Text for formatting. So Friendica converts this into the corresponding formatting in Rich Text, and on Hubzilla and (streams), the optional ActivityPub bridge PubCrawl does that.

Mastodon, in turn, has introduced some Rich Text displaying capabilities with version 4.0.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #TextFormatting #BBcode #RichText

@ᴚ uɐᗡ It's called a quote. Standard feature on Friendica, Hubzilla (where I am), (streams), the now-deceased rest of the family, Misskey and all its forks etc., basically everywhere that isn't Mastodon.

Within Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams), it's handled basically the same way as on good old bulletin-board forums: in BBcode.
[quote]if the process is really that involved and if they can fix it[/quote]

(streams) also has ways of doing that with Markdown or HTML.

There are various different ways of getting that code, also depending on whether one replies to a post or a comment.

ActivityPub uses Rich Text for formatting. So Friendica converts this into the corresponding formatting in Rich Text, and on Hubzilla and (streams), the optional ActivityPub bridge PubCrawl does that.

Mastodon, in turn, has introduced some Rich Text displaying capabilities with version 4.0.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #TextFormatting #BBcode #RichText

@ᴚ uɐᗡ It's called a quote. Standard feature on Friendica, Hubzilla (where I am), (streams), the now-deceased rest of the family, Misskey and all its forks etc., basically everywhere that isn't Mastodon.

Within Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams), it's handled basically the same way as on good old bulletin-board forums: in BBcode.
[quote]if the process is really that involved and if they can fix it[/quote]

(streams) also has ways of doing that with Markdown or HTML.

There are various different ways of getting that code, also depending on whether one replies to a post or a comment.

ActivityPub uses Rich Text for formatting. So Friendica converts this into the corresponding formatting in Rich Text, and on Hubzilla and (streams), the optional ActivityPub bridge PubCrawl does that.

Mastodon, in turn, has introduced some Rich Text displaying capabilities with version 4.0.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #TextFormatting #BBcode #RichText

@ᴚ uɐᗡ It's called a quote. Standard feature on Friendica, Hubzilla (where I am), (streams), the now-deceased rest of the family, Misskey and all its forks etc., basically everywhere that isn't Mastodon.

Within Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams), it's handled basically the same way as on good old bulletin-board forums: in BBcode.
[quote]if the process is really that involved and if they can fix it[/quote]

(streams) also has ways of doing that with Markdown or HTML.

There are various different ways of getting that code, also depending on whether one replies to a post or a comment.

ActivityPub uses Rich Text for formatting. So Friendica converts this into the corresponding formatting in Rich Text, and on Hubzilla and (streams), the optional ActivityPub bridge PubCrawl does that.

Mastodon, in turn, has introduced some Rich Text displaying capabilities with version 4.0.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #TextFormatting #BBcode #RichText

@Daniel de Kay The biggest cultural difference based on server software has to be between Mastodon on the one hand and the Mike Macgirvin creations Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams) on the other hand.

Not only do they have vastly different user bases, but they developed independently from one another. When the Mastodon culture developed, those who shaped it didn't even know the other side, so they couldn't adopt any of its culture.

Said other side's culture dates back to 2010 when Friendica was launched as Mistpark, and since that was almost six years before Mastodon, it couldn't be inspired by Mastodon's culture either.

Add to that that these respective cultures are greatly shaped by technical features and limitations or the lack thereof.

Mastodon's culture is largely built around its 500-character limit which is ample for your typical phone-wielding Mastodon user. Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams) don't have any defined character limit whatsoever, and its target audience is largely on desktop or laptop computers, often running Linux, with large screens and full-size hardware keyboards.

So it's the most normal thing in the world for them to write in one post as much as they want while Mastodon users debate whether threads are good, or you should always limit yourself to 500 characters or less.

Also, alt-text. Mastodon has many disabled users, including blind or visually-impaired users. And it has a dedicated alt-text field for each image. On top of that, it offers 1,500 characters for each alt-text which, in connection with the 500-character limit for toots, has people write detailed image descriptions and explanations and put them into the alt-text. That's often information that doesn't even belong in alt-text, but there's no room for it elsewhere.

Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams) have unlimited room, so putting stuff into alt-text because the post text is too limited seems ridiculous. But they don't have a vocal disabled community, so there's little interest in accessibility. And neither of them has a dedicated alt-text field. Alt-text is supported, but it has to be manually grafted into the image-embedding code in the post. And there's no official documentation for that, I think not even for Friendica which is the only one out of the three with actually useful end-user documentation.

It's similar with content warnings. On Mastodon, they're put into the repurposed summary field, and next to nobody knows that it's a repurposed summary field rather than invented for content warnings from scratch. So since Mastodon has a content warning field, writer-side content warnings are huge, but also cause for drama.

Mastodon 4.0 has introduced filters that can create reader-side content warnings, but hardly anyone uses them, even fewer people support them with keywords or hashtags, many don't even know this feature exists, and it's generally ignored because it's un-Mastodon.

The Friendica/Hubzilla/(streams) complex doesn't have a content warning field. Hubzilla and (streams) have a summary field labelled as such. Friendica doesn't even have that; it uses a pair of BBcode tags for that.

And within their own ecosystem, they don't even need it. They've got the "NSFW app" instead, an over-one-decade-old, optional, simple-as-anything substring filter that automatically hides entire posts with all media and everything behind content warnings if it finds one of the entered keywords or hashtags.

So they can't understand Mastodon's commotion about content warnings, and Mastodon users can't understand why they don't add Mastodon-style content warnings.

And then there are all the things that were or are being debated on Mastodon and whether or not it should introduce them. Especially the second-wave Twitter refugees are often staunchly against them.

Full-text search and quote-tweets are being actively used on Twitter to track down and harass members of minorities who have fled to Mastodon. Of course, they don't want Mastodon to introduce either. That is, in the case of full-text search, Mastodon has found a solution, but one that doesn't really federate to the rest of the Fediverse.

Quotes and text formatting are seen as bad, too. Many don't know quotes because Twitter doesn't have them, and so they think quotes could be used as tools of harassment. And both are seen as making Mastodon feel less like Mastodon and more complicated.

Friendica and Hubzilla had all this before there was Mastodon, and (streams) inherited it from its long line of ancestors. Their users have gotten so used to having all this that they don't understand what the problems should be, also because they're so detached from Mastodon's culture. So they keep on using these features unashamedly, even around Mastodon users.

Some differences are rather simple. Take mentions, for example. Friendica has always used long names for mentions, as does its offspring. Mastodon users may find that freaky. Meanwhile, Friendica, Hubzilla or (streams) users may find Mastodon's mentions cryptic because they use the short name. But even they matter.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #FediverseCulture #Fediverse #Mastodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #500Characters #CW #CWs #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #AltText #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #Quotes #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoost #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuotedShares #TextFormatting #FullTextSearch