#cwalttextmeta — Public Fediverse posts
Live and recent posts from across the Fediverse tagged #cwalttextmeta, aggregated by home.social.
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@Mark Wyner Won’t Comply :vm: First of all, you completely forgot the social media posters. The TOC link leads nowhere.
Also, maybe it's fair to mention that I'm working on an entire wiki about alt-texts and image descriptions, especially for the Fediverse. 46 pages are planned as of now, 24 of them are already written. These will include over 30 pages on how to do things, how not to do things and what never to do at all.
I won't add step-by-step guides for certain frontends. But I've already started adding rules and guidelines for how to describe images appropriately and write alt-texts in a way that won't break stuff anywhere.
Even if it's a very incomplete WIP, it's unique in several ways:- It's the only wiki about alt-texts and image descriptions. Few writers have even only written multiple pages or articles on this subject.
- It's the only guide that takes the existence of the Fediverse outside of Mastodon into consideration. This means that it's also the only guide that doesn't assume that Fediverse equals always having only 500 characters for the message text. It actually recommends an additional, longer image description in the message text in certain situations, regardless of whether or not vanilla Mastodon users can do that.
- It's the only guide that, instead of regurgitating the alt-text rules for webpages and blogs and assuming that they apply to the Fediverse just the same, talks about the peculiarities of posting images into the Fediverse, how Mastodon's alt-text quality criteria are different from the W3C WAI and WCAG alt-text quality criteria, and why it's critically important to know and fulfill Mastodon's requirements for good alt-texts.
- It's probably the only guide that doesn't assume that you can always precisely target a certain audience for your content and make sure that only those receive it who understand it right off the bat.
- It is the only guide that lists over 60 references, including your blog post, but also including university webpages as well as over two dozen guides from Veronica Lewis a.k.a. Veronica with Four Eyes.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta -
CW: Account getting away with way subpar alt-texts only because it's too niche with too few followers; CW: long (over 1,700 characters), Fediverse meta, alt-text meta, image description meta, character limit meta
I've just discovered a certain Mastodon account that seems to automatically post images of Second Life avatars. It can be lucky to only have eight followers, one of them being a search engine, the others being Second Life users.
If it had more follower, it would certainly already have met the wrath of the wider Mastodon community, especially the Mastodon HOA, for breaking Mastodon's unwritten rules.
And I'm not even talking about nigh-nudity in some of the images with no warning, no image flagging, no hashtag. I'm talking about the alt-texts that are vastly below Mastodon's requirements and quality standards for alt-texts.
Granted, all things considered, the requirements for good image descriptions by Mastodon's standards have to be extremely hard and tedious to meet, at least by my personal estimations. In fact, they have to be impossible to meet on Mastodon itself due to its tiny character limit, and if this account was somewhere where it could meet these requirements, it'd probably be blocked by loads of Mastodon accounts for its excessively long posts due to the long image descriptions.
But if more Mastodon users knew it right now, it'd probably be blocked by many more Mastodon accounts than follow it.
If you post from virtual worlds into the Fediverse, you simply cannot win in the long run. You'll lose either way.
#SecondLife #Metaverse #VirtualWorld #VirtualWorlds #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #Mastodon #MastodonHOA #MastodonCulture -
@David Since you're on Mastodon, you most likely haven't read this comment of mine. So here it is again:
RE: https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/item/762e395f-8033-4fae-a636-058b185fc8b4
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #QuotePost #QuoteTweet #QuoteToot #QuotePost #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #A11y #Accessibility -
@TeflonTrout :bc: he/him @Sharp Leaves Still, forcing Mastodon's culture and Mastodon's unwritten rules upon literally everyone in the Fediverse is bad.
Maybe you haven't heard about this yet, but: The Fediverse is not only Mastodon. It has never been only Mastodon. It didn't even start with Mastodon. And it doesn't entirely work like Mastodon either.
For starters, this means that just because you see it on Mastodon, it didn't necessarily originate on Mastodon.
There are places in the Fediverse that are vastly older than Mastodon, and that are very different from Mastodon. Thus, they have their own culture, based on their own technology and their own features and where their users came from, and largely without any influences from Mastodon.
The oldest still existing server software in the Fediverse is not Mastodon from 2016. It's Friendica (https://friendi.ca, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friendica, https://joinfediverse.wiki/Friendica). Friendica is essentially a mixture of a Facebook alternative and fully-featured long-form blogging. No Twitter or Mastodon influence anywhere. And Friendica first came out in May, 2010, five years and eight months before Mastodon.
Friendica did not intrude into the Mastodon Fediverse that was created by Eugen Rochko as a Mastodon-only network. Mastodon was born into an already existing Fediverse that consisted of at least Friendica, Hubzilla (https://hubzilla.org, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubzilla, https://joinfediverse.wiki/Hubzilla) and GNU social (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_social; now defunct).
Here's how Friendica differs from Mastodon in ways that may disturb Mastodon hardliners:- Mastodon is hard-coded to 500 characters. This character limit is deeply engrained into Mastodon's culture.
Friendica doesn't have an arbitrary character limit; it's limited by the maximum size of the database field for the post text. Currently, this is 16,777,215 characters. Thus, Friendica doesn't have keeping messages short in its culture, it never has, and it never will. - Mastodon users tend to be eager to block anyone who doesn't cut long posts into pieces of no more than 500 characters each.
I know at least one Friendica veteran who blocks everyone upon first strike who does cut long posts into annoying strings of tiny chunks. - Mastodon introduced a CW field in 2017.
Friendica has had the exact same field as a summary/abstract field since its own beginning in 2010. That, and Friendica has always had a much more efficient way of handling CWs, one that Mastodon itself adopted with version 4.0 in October, 2022. Thus, by its technology and culture, Friendica users despise misusing their abstract field to force the same CW upon everyone out there with a hot, flaming passion.
So if you see someone "misusing" the CW field for "a subject or a summary or whatever that is," that might not be a clueless Mastodon user. Instead, it might be a Friendica user who has been around for a dozen years longer than you, who is used to living by Friendica's culture, and who knows tons more about the Fediverse than you do. - Friendica users are much less likely to add alt-texts to their images. That's for two reasons.
One, Friendica's culture is not an idealised version of pre-Musk, very-left-wing Twitter's culture. It does not include attacking and punishing everyone who doesn't add 100% hand-written, 100% accurate, sufficiently detailed alt-texts to their images.
Two, Friendica handles images drastically differently from Mastodon. Mastodon always has a nifty little entry field for alt-texts whenever you attach an image. On Friendica, images are embedded into posts rather than attached to them, like in a blog post. And oftentimes, you literally have to program the alt-text into the raw image embedding markup code. - On Mastodon, it's considered intrusive and reply-guying to reply to someone who hasn't mentioned you, and to whom you aren't mutually connected. You couldn't possibly have received the toot that you're replying to otherwise.
On Friendica, that's perfectly normal. Friendica doesn't show you single messages by default. It always shows you the entire conversation thread, all the way up to the start post, with all branches. Thus, neither Friendica's technology nor Friendica's culture rules out replying to any comment in the thread. - Mastodon has only just introduced Twitter-style quote-posts a few months ago. With a safety feature that only works on Mastodon and GoToSocial for fear of that feature being used for harassment and dogpiling just like on Twitter. And because literally everyone on Mastodon comes from Twitter, it's actually being used for harassment and dogpiling.
Friendica has had that very same feature since its inception in 2010, over a decade and a half longer. It has never not had this feature. It has always been able to quote-post any public message in the Fediverse. But since Friendica is not entirely populated by former Twitter users, it hasn't been used for harassment or dogpiling even once. It's only used to forward content. For most of the time, it literally was the only available way to forward a message. - Mastodon users tend to be very protective and defensive about their allegedly Mastodon-only Fediverse.
Friendica users are used to being able to connect with everything that moves and then some. It's one of Friendica's key features that it speaks a whole lot of protocols, not just ActivityPub.
Whereas Mastodon users see Mastodon as a "decentralised walled garden", Friendica users see Friendica as the gateway to the whole federated social Web plus some places that aren't, strictly speaking, federated. - Mastodon users will staunchly insist that "Fediverse" and "Mastodon" essentially mean the same because they believe they do. They will attack anyone who claims otherwise.
Friendica users will staunchly insist that there's a huge difference between "Fediverse" and "Mastodon" because they actually know there is one. They will lecture anyone who claims otherwise.
Of course, from a Mastodon point of view, it's both tempting and fully justified to tell the Friendica users that this is the Mastodon Fediverse, and that they will have to adapt the Mastodon culture and abolish their own culture or be thrown out. But for one, Mastodon's culture doesn't fit Friendica's technology.
Besides, that'd literally be like European settlers holding Native Americans at gunpoint and forcing them to give up their own culture, adopt European culture and convert to Catholic Christianity or else. The only difference is that European settlers, unlike the Mastodon users, did not think that they were there first, and that everyone else is an intruder.
I mean, sure, go ahead and attack anyone who doesn't strictly live by Mastodon's culture and Mastodon's rules if you think you have to. But prepare for a whole lot of defence and even counter-attacks from Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Iceshrimp-JS, Iceshrimp.NET, Sharkey, GoToSocial, Hollo, snac2, Mitra, Socialhome, Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams), Forte and the rest of the non-Mastodon Fediverse.
CC: @Jan Wildeboer
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #500Characters #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate #Fediverse #Mastodon #Friendica #NotOnlyMastodon #FediverseIsNotMastodon #MastodonIsNotTheFediverse - Mastodon is hard-coded to 500 characters. This character limit is deeply engrained into Mastodon's culture.
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CW: @[email protected] being intentionally ableist and defending his ableism; CW: long (over 5,000 characters), quote-post, explicit language, Fediverse meta, alt-text meta, ableism meta
I'm usually friendly. But challenge me, and I'll fight. If you fight dirty, then so will I.
And this time I'll fight for accessibility. Against someone who is actively fighting against accessibility and intentionally acting in most ableist ways.
In the below post, @Mat B explains that he adds content into his alt-texts that isn't available anywhere else in the post.
RE: https://beige.party/@TwoClownsEating/115571481219795582
You may or may not know, but this is actually ableist behaviour because it discriminates against those who cannot access alt-text, for example, people who don't have at least one working hand.
I have explained it in the wiki about alt-texts and image descriptions that I'm working on. For Mastodon users' convenience, here are the links as URLs in plain sight:
https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/wiki/jupiter_rowland/How(20)to(20)describe(20)images(20)in(20)the(20)Fediverse/Don(27)t(20)explain(20)things(20)or(20)give(20)other(20)information(20)only(20)in(20)alt-text(21)
https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/wiki/jupiter_rowland/How(20)to(20)describe(20)images(20)in(20)the(20)Fediverse/Don(27)t(20)use(20)alt-text(20)to(20)write(20)around(20)your(20)character(20)limit(21)
https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/wiki/jupiter_rowland/How(20)to(20)describe(20)images(20)in(20)the(20)Fediverse/Can(20)everyone(20)access(20)alt-text(3f)
See also this post, https://www.kwbell.eu/mastonotes/alt-text-for-mastodon-images/, by @KB.
So I did what I feel is my duty. I told him how and why this is wrong. Thousands upon thousands of Mastodon users see it as absolutely justified to tell everyone to write alt-text, so why shouldn't I tell people how to write proper alt-text as opposed to misusing it?
RE: https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/item/11550d0a-a8d1-42b6-9924-973ef9cc7652
@Mat B, however, did not accept that he has been wrong all the time. Instead, he chose to attack me to defend his utterly ableist ways.
RE: https://beige.party/@TwoClownsEating/115572513612903964
Obviously, he doesn't know whom he is picking on. I have been in the Fediverse under various guises for about five years longer than Mastodon has even been around. I have spent much more time on Fediverse server software that is vastly more powerful than Mastodon than he has spent on Mastodon.
Congrats, @Mat B, YOU ABSOLUTELY MOTHERFUCKING HORRID STEAMING FERMENTING PILE OF MISANTHROPIC AND ABLEIST SHIT. you left me no other option than to take the Teller-Ulam thermonuclear option.
@Velocirooster adminensis :bc:: @Mat B is an absolute disgrace to beige.party, a Mastodon server that I got to know as a lighthouse of inclusivity and accessibility. He is deliberately and intentionally breaking sever rule number 2, defending his misbehaviour and attacking those who try to educate him about how to actually be inclusive and accessible. In the name of beige.party and the entire Fediverse, I hereby demand he be permanently banned from beige.party, effective immediately.
In addition, I recommend everyone who treasures and fights for actual accessibility and full inclusivity to block @Mat B.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #QuotePost #QuoteTweet #QuoteToot #QuoteBoost #Ableist #Ableism #AbleismMeta #CWAbleismMeta -
CW: Posting sensitive images if you can't make Mastodon blank them out? CW: long (almost 3,000 characters), Fediverse meta, non-Mastodon Fediverse meta, sensitive media meta, eye contact mentioned, alt-text meta, image description meta
Could there possibly any way for me to post images containing sensitive content, including eye contact, in a way that's fully inclusive for- blind or visually-impaired users
- neurodiverse users who need detailed image descriptions
- autistic users who are easily triggered by eye contact
- other traumatised users who need certain content safely hidden from them?
I can't do it the usual way by embedding the image in the post, including a short, visual description in the alt-text and a full, detailed description with explanations and transcripts in the post itself. That's simply because I can't make Mastodon blank the image out, and unlike Hubzilla, Mastodon doesn't hide images behind summaries/content warnings. So that's out of question.
One option would be to make use of my virtual worlds privacy group (for Mastodon users: Privacy groups are lists on steroids and tons of coke) and send the posts only to those of my contacts who are into virtual worlds. This would prevent any leaking of my posts into public timelines/streams and to users who aren't in the privacy group because these posts couldn't even be boosted.
That way, I wouldn't have to take any accessibility measures because I know that what few people would ever receive my posts don't need any of them. But it'd be like cheating. Also, it'd greatly reduce the visibility of my posts.
Another option would be to link to the image pages on my channel like this one rather than to embed the images in the post.
Not only couldn't even Mastodon keep me from posting more than four images at once, but I know for certain that Mastodon doesn't generate preview images of Hubzilla image pages, so the images would stay unseen until someone clicks an image link. I could simply warn about sensitive content in an image right above the link. It's the only surefire way for me to hide a sensitive image from a general audience everywhere in the Fediverse.
This would have two disadvantages itself, though. For one, I can't add alt-text to an image as it's shown on its image page on Hubzilla, for example. The best I could do would be to add an image description as a comment below the image, and I would have to do that, also because that image page is still part of Hubzilla, thus part of the Fediverse, thus, the rules of the Fediverse apply.
Besides, for those on dedicated mobile apps, the image page would not appear in the mobile app. It would cause the default Web browser on their devices to open, and then the browser would show it. That'd be quite inconvenient, also because the context, the image and the image description wouldn't all be in one place.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hubzilla #PrivacyGroups #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #SensitiveImages #A11y #Accessibility