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#cwfediversemeta — Public Fediverse posts

Live and recent posts from across the Fediverse tagged #cwfediversemeta, aggregated by home.social.

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  1. @stefan (シュテファン) Also, Friendica strictly distinguises between posts (which are never replies) and comments (replies are always this). Unlike on Mastodon, they work very differently, and they're handled very differently.

    Posting to a Friendica group only works with posts, as in, start posts that aren't replies.

    My suggestion:
    • Edit the start post.
    • Copy the whole post code into a text editor.
    • Start writing a new post.
    • Mention the Friendica Support group in the appropriate way.
    • Paste the copied post code in, minus any mentions.

    #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Groups #FediGroups #FediverseGroups #Friendica
  2. Allow me to chime in here, everyone.

    First of all, accessibility is a basic human right.

    There actually are blind or visually-impaired users in the Fediverse, also because they're more welcome here than in the corporate silos.

    This also means: Just like alt-texts, a Web UI that works with screen reader software (JAWS, NVDA, VoiceOver, TalkBack, Narrator, Orca etc.) is not just another dumb Mastodon fad.

    If activists like @Robert Kingett (who, by the way, is blind, and who has some significant range in the Fediverse) criticise Hubzilla for being unusable, this has to be taken seriously. Even though, admittedly, Hubzilla's Web UI using the Redbasic theme isn't even that friendly towards sighted users.

    In my opinion, Hubzilla has two options now.

    One, carry on as usually, consider it a Mastodon fad that must under no circumstances be adopted, shrug it off, chase all the blind users away back to Mastodon and eventually be branded utterly ableist.

    Two, if that's possible in any way, make the Redbasic-based default Web UI accessible to screen reader users and become one of the currently not exactly many Fediverse server applications that do care for UI accessibility.

    The latter explicitly welcomes blind users. The former flips the bird at them, now that the "Hubzilla is inaccessible" cat is out of the bag.

    Combine this with Hubzilla's notoriously condescending attitude towards Mastodon (where just about everyone who is blind hangs out because they literally don't have much of a choice), and you get a condescending attitude towards disabled people.

    Ideally, at least @Saiwal should do the same with his themes. Even though many hub admins refuse to install them because they were written entirely by AI, especially Solidified appears to make using Hubzilla much easier in general.

    I can see many veterans who have come from Facebook or nothing at all to Friendica to Hubzilla, whose contacts are all on Hubzilla, Friendica, (streams) and/or Forte, or who have intentionally left PubCrawl uninstalled, shrug it off. We've never needed accessibility. Even if it comes back to bite Hubzilla because the whole platform is being ostracised, sanctioned or even gradually blocked from lots of other Fediverse servers, they'll say that's no loss. For it's no loss to them.

    But they mustn't wonder then how come Hubzilla can't get enough of a foothold in the Fediverse for more people to come over from all that underequipped stuff. Especially if Hubzilla not only ignores, but explicitly rejects accessibility.

    And no, third-party add-ons can't fix this. Many Hub admins won't install these either.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hubzilla #Inclusion #A11y #Accessibility
  3. @stefan (シュテファン) I don't think you can post to a Friendica group from Friendica with a simple @ mention. AFAIK, it requires a ! mention.

    @ mention only works from places like Mastodon that don't support any other kinds of mentions.

    #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Groups #FediGroups #FediverseGroups #Friendica
  4. @Ruby Skunkloon
    For both alt text and CWs, I wish there was a more automated way to handle this. Like, having canned CW tags at the ready, or an image detection bot that actually works as intended for filling out alt text. (That's before getting into the weeds of "AI", which is contentious in itself.)

    For CWs, in theory, things could be a whole lot better. A whole lot better than what Mastodon's culture demands.

    Instead of the writer supplying a CW and forcing the self-same CW upon all readers all the same, CWs could be automatically generated on the readers' side. Like, those who need that particular CW get it, and those who don't need it don't get it.

    This is technically possible. Mastodon has introduced it with version 4.0 in October, 2022. It's a filter setting. In general, this has been available in the Fediverse since 2010 when Friendica introduced it first. On Friendica and all its descendants, CW culture has always been built around this rather than writing CWs into the summary field and forcing them upon everyone all the same.

    This has got a few downsides, though:
    • Writers still have to remember to take care of adding filter-triggering keywords.
    • The best way to add keywords without shoehorning them into the text is as hashtags, but many Mastodon users have a problem with more than, say, four hashtags per message.
    • Whereas Friendica and its descendants simply have a keyword list for this purpose, Mastodon requires one new filter to be set up for each keyword.
    • I guess there are lots of Mastodon apps that don't have creating or editing filters built in. And I know there are lots of Mastodon users who would never ever touch Mastodon's Web UI under any circumstances.
    • Mastodon users are used to being coddled and pampered all over. Most of them would never take care of CWs being generated on their side by themselves. They expect CWs to be served to them by the writers.
    • And then there are those Fediverse server applications that either don't have a hiding/CW-generating filter or no filters at all.

    Fully automated, zero-click, fire-and-forget image description generators have been desired by Mastodon users for about as long as alt-texts have been a thing. But let me tell you: Fully automated, fire-and-forget image description generators that can describe any image perfectly accurately are utopic. Even more if they're also expected to adhere to all existing image-describing and alt-text rules and adapt the descriptions both to the context and to the audience that's to be expected.

    Trust me. My original images could barely be more obscure and niche. They're renderings from extremely obscure 3-D virtual worlds. And I've actually had two of them described by an AI after writing my own highly detailed image descriptions 100% by hand with no AI assistance. It took me several hours to write one description and two days to write the other one.

    The results were abysmal. The AI descriptions were no match for my hand-written descriptions at all. They omitted things that really stood out in the images, they got things wrong, they guessed things that I knew for a fact.

    Granted, it was extra unfair because the AI only had the image to look at whereas I wrote the image descriptions by looking at the real deal in-world with an almost infinitely higher resolution, with the ability to look around obstacles even. Still, at least for my own images, I consider this style of writing image descriptions the benchmark. AI will never get there. It will never have the extreme niche knowledge of an expert, and it will never be able to see things that I see.

    CC: @Princess Nettles Succubish

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #MastodonCulture #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #AI #LLM #LLMs #AIVsHuman #HumanVsAI
  5. @Alex R @✨pencilears✨(KD7POW) @Princess Nettles Succubish There's so much that next to nobody on Mastodon knows about alt-texts.

    For example, how inconvenient long alt-texts are for screen reader users. Or what a screen reader is in the first place.

    Or that there are people who cannot access alt-texts, and therefore writing around character limits by putting explanations and other information exclusively into the alt-text counters accessibility. (In fact, that there are also other disabilities and disorders present in the Fediverse than visual impairments.)

    Or that Misskey and its various forks and forks of forks (Sharkey, Iceshrimp-JS, Catodon, CherryPick etc.) have an alt-text character limit of only 512. That they're supposed to truncate longer alt-texts at this mark. And that, due to a bug that still hasn't been fixed, they silently delete such alt-texts instead, giving the impression that there hasn't been an alt-text to begin with. (Or that Misskey and its various forks and forks of forks exist in the first place.)

    The attitude is rather that any and all information that someone may need about an image must immediately come with the post. In the alt-text, of course. Explanations included. Because, you know, having to ask for explanations or having to ask for a description of a detail is almost as bad as having to ask for an image description in the first place. Such appears to be Mastodon's alt-text culture.

    Those affected the most are people like me. People who only ever post images about super-obscure niche topics. In my case, that's renderings from extremely obscure 3-D virtual worlds, memes about these virtual worlds and memes about the Fediverse (not limited to memes about Mastodon). They all require extensive explanations, and the former require extensive visual descriptions, at least judging by what Mastodon's culture seems to demand. I mean, how is anyone supposed to know what anything looks like in my images?

    At least I don't really have any character limits for message texts to worry about, so my long descriptions and explanations can go into the message text of only one single post. Still, I think we have proof now that the alt-text police demands a sufficiently descriptive alt-text even when the image is extensively described in the message text.

    I guess nobody on Mastodon has ever really had a problem with me filling Mastodon's alt-text character limit up to the very last character. They'd rather mute or block me for exceeding 500 characters in the message text.

    At least all this rarely happens. Describing and explaining images while trying to adhere to all the rules and guidelines out there, Mastodon's culture included, has become so tedious and time-consuming that I haven't posted a single non-meme image in over two years now.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Sharkey #Iceshrimp #IceshrimpJS #Catodon #CherryPick #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #ScreenReader #ScreenReaders #MastodonCulture
  6. @✨pencilears✨(KD7POW)
    I think a lot of people have unrealistically high expectations for alt text, and as a consequence they add a bunch of fluff, which makes writing alt-text feel daunting if that's the standard.

    Looking at this phenomenon from outside of Mastodon (I'm on Hubzilla), I've got the impression that this has become engrained into Mastodon's very culture.

    Mastodon has a limit of 1,500 characters so that the text in images with a lot of text can be transcribed in alt-text. However, many Mastodon users, knowing everything they know about online accessibility, take this as an invitation to write very detailed visual descriptions. Other Mastodon users cheer and applaud for these long descriptions.

    Maybe it's just my impression. Maybe I'm wrong. But I kind of expect at least some Mastodon users to start both demanding and enforcing very long and detailed alt-texts/image descriptions, regardless of long alt-texts actually being bad for various reasons and even Mastodon users saying so.

    I mean, I've already read several times that images must also be explained if their topic or their content is uncommon. In the alt-text, of course. Even though explanations in the alt-text are not accessible to people with certain disabilities. But most Mastodon users can't imagine that at least some Fediverse users can pour thousands or even millions of characters into the message text.

    Nonetheless, this gives the impression of Mastodon's culture demanding any and all extra information that people may need about an image be immediately delivered on a silver platter, along with the image.

    Granted, if what the image shows is obscure enough, and especially if it also might make people curious enough, this appears to be justified. The former definitely does apply to my own original images, and chances are the latter applies, too. Technically speaking, my original images need a whole lot of explanation because nobody has ever even heard of what they show, and they also need highly detailed descriptions because nobody who can't see the image has even only the faintest idea of what anything in the image looks like.

    So what I do is describe each one of my original images twice. One description is the long description; it's fully detailed, it contains transcripts of all bits of text within the borders of the image, and it contains all necessary explanations. It goes into the message text, and it's pretty much always a five-digit number of characters long.

    The other description is shorter, and it goes into the alt-text in order to satisfy those alt-text hardliners who demand there be an actually descriptive alt-text even if there's an extremely detailed image description in the message text. I used to fill Mastodon's limit of 1,500 characters up almost or actually entirely. My future alt-texts might be limited to a bit over 500 characters because Misskey and its many forks delete alt-texts that are longer than 512 characters. (Then again, they also discard anything with a message text of over 10,000 characters, I think.)

    Describing one image takes me from several hours up to two full days. I rarely receive any praise for this effort. But I guess the downside is that each original image that I post has the channel on which I post my original images now (as rarely as this happens) silently muted or blocked by a whole number of Mastodon users for exceeding the holy 500-character limit.

    I try to play it safe. I try to always be ahead of Mastodon's alt-text police, far enough for them not to demand I edit the image descriptions of a three-year-old image post because they're sub-standard. So in addition to these monster descriptions, I have over 30 rules and guidelines for describing images and writing alt-texts that I adhere to as strictly as I possibly can. And yes, I also expect most of them to be enforced by the alt-text police sooner or later.

    CC: @Princess Nettles Succubish

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #MastodonCulture
  7. @Todos Locos Außerdem haben Hashtags noch eine Funktion: Man kann sie anklicken oder antippen, um noch mehr Beiträge mit demselben Hashtag zu finden.

    Sagen wir, ich schreibe irgendwas von Hubzilla. Du verstehst aber nur Bahnhof, weil du dir unter Hubzilla absolut nichts vorstellen kannst. Oder das interessiert dich aus anderen Gründen dafür und willst mehr darüber lesen.

    Unter meinem Beitrag ist aber der Hashtag #Hubzilla. Schön farblich hervorgehoben wie ein Link.

    Weil das ein Link ist.

    Den kannst du anklicken oder antippen, und dann werden dir andere Inhalte mit dem Hashtag #Hubzilla angezeigt, in denen es also um Hubzilla geht.

    Ich meine, es gibt ja genügend Leute auf Mastodon, die erkennen Links nur als solche, wenn sie eine URL sind: https://norden.social/search?q=%23Hubzilla. Anscheinend haben sie auch auf Twitter nicht gelernt, daß man Hashtags anklicken oder antippen kann.

    (5/6)

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hashtag #Hashtags #HashtagMeta #CWHashtagMeta
  8. @Todos Locos

    Warum mache ich dann keine "richtige" CW?


    Weil ich das nicht immer kann. Weil das auf Hubzilla bei Antworten nämlich nicht geht, weil das auf Hubzilla bei Antworten überhaupt nicht vorgesehen ist.

    Mastodon ist wie Twitter.

    Ein Thread besteht aus Posts, Posts und noch mehr Posts. Es gibt nur einen Editor für alles. Damit kann man auch überall jederzeit eine CW dranhängen.

    Das CW-Feld ist das CW-Feld. Und beinahe jeder auf Mastodon "weiß", daß das CW-Feld auf Mastodon als CW-Feld erfunden wurde. (Wurde es übrigens nicht. Siehe unten.)

    Hubzilla ist nicht wie Twitter. Überhaupt nicht.

    Hubzilla ist wie ein Blog. Oder wie Facebook. Wie eigentlich alles außerhalb des Fediverse, das nicht Twitter oder ein Twitter-Klon ist.

    Auf Hubzilla besteht ein Thread aus genau einem Post ganz oben, und alle Antworten sind Kommentare. Wie Kommentare auf Facebook. Oder wie Blogkommentare.

    Und genau wie auf Facebook und in jedem Blog da draußen gibt es für Kommentare einen anderen Editor als für Posts.

    Was seit 2017 das CW-Feld auf Mastodon ist, ist auf Hubzilla schon seit 2015, also schon immer, ein Zusammenfassungsfeld. Im ganzen Fediverse ist es seit 2008 ein Zusammenfassungsfeld.

    Dieses Zusammenfassungsfeld gibt's natürlich nur für Posts. Für Kommentare gibt's das nicht. Auf Facebook nicht, in Blogs auch nicht und damit auch nicht auf Hubzilla. Oder hast du schon mal einen Blogkommentar mit Zusammenfassung gesehen?

    Warum überhaupt ein Zusammenfassungsfeld?


    Die Frage muß umgekehrt gestellt werden: Warum hat Mastodon kein Zusammenfassungsfeld?

    Weil Mastodon standardmäßig nur 500 Zeichen erlaubt. Man kann gar nicht soviel schreiben, daß das eine Zusammenfassung braucht.

    Hubzilla erlaubt über 16,7 Millionen Zeichen. Im Grunde gibt's gar kein Zeichenlimit. Das ist kein Microblogging. Das war nie Microblogging. Das war schon kein Microblogging, als Mastodon mit seinen 500 Zeichen angekommen ist. Da kann man so lange Posts schreiben, daß die wirklich mal eine Zusammenfassung brauchen.

    (4/6)

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #Hubzilla #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta
  9. @Todos Locos

    Warum jetzt die Hashtags mit "CW"?


    Weil die auch für CWs vorgesehen sind.

    Kennst du die Filter auf Mastodon? Kennst du "Mit einer Warnung ausblenden"?

    Das erzeugt aus einem Schlüsselwort sowas wie eine CW. Auf deiner Seite als Leser. Ganz individuell nur für dich und nicht für alle anderen, die den jeweiligen Post bekommen haben.

    Mastodon hat das erst seit Version 4.0, seit Oktober 2022. In Mastodons Kultur ist das nie angekommen. Das kennt auf Mastodon keiner.

    Hier auf Hubzilla gibt's sowas schon länger, als es Mastodon überhaupt gibt. Hier war es schon immer Teil der Kultur.

    Um aber so ein Filter auslösen zu können, braucht es im Beitrag ein entsprechendes Schlüsselwort. Beispiel:

    #CWLong, #CWLongPost und #CWLangerPost = "CW: langer Post ( Zeichen)".

    Wer meine Beiträge mit mehr als 500 Zeichen nicht sehen will, legt sich auf Mastodon ein Filter an mit "#CWLongPost". Wer sie wie bei einer CW nur hinter einem Button verborgen haben will, schaltet auf "Mit einer Warnung ausblenden".

    #CWFediMeta und #CWFediverseMeta = "CW: Fediverse-Meta" = "CW: Jupiter Rowland schreibt wieder irgendwelchen verqueren Quatsch über Hashtags und wie sie auf Mastodon niemand jemals anwendet. Nichts davon ist auch nur in der Nähe von Mastodons Standards und Mastodons Kultur."

    Und so weiter.

    Da steht "CW" dran, damit klar ist, daß die für CWs da sind und quasi die Funktion von CWs übernehmen.

    (3/6)

    #Long #LongPost #LangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #Mastodon #Hubzilla #Hashtag #Hashtags #HashtagMeta #CWHashtagMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta
  10. @Todos Locos

    Warum vier oder sechs Hashtags für ein und dasselbe Thema?


    Weil die teilweise schon vorher existieren. Weil es auf Mastodon so kompliziert ist, auch nur ein Schlüsselwort zu filtern, daß niemand alle filtert.

    Weil aber auch nicht alle dasselbe Schlüsselwort filtern.

    Die einen filtern #FediMeta, aber nicht #FediverseMeta. Die anderen filtern #FediverseMeta, aber nicht #FediMeta. Also muß ich beide abdecken.

    (2/6)

    #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hashtag #Hashtags #HashtagMeta #CWHashtagMeta
  11. @Todos Locos Also nochmal von vorne:

    Warum brauche ich soviele Hashtags?


    Ich brauche sehr viele Hashtags, damit Leute meine Beiträge filtern können, wenn sie das, was da drin steht, nicht lesen wollen.

    #Long, #LongPost, #CWLong und #CWLongPost für die, die meine Beiträge mit mehr als 500 Zeichen nicht lesen wollen. Und ich schreibe ständig mehr als 500 Zeichen.

    #LangerPost und #CWLangerPost nochmal als Zusatz für deutschsprachige Nutzer, damit die verstehen, was es mit #Long, #LongPost, #CWLong und #CWLongPost auf sich hat.

    #FediMeta, #FediverseMeta, #CWFediMeta und #CWFediverseMeta für die, die meine Beiträge über das Fediverse nicht lesen wollen. Weil:
    • Bei mir ist das Fediverse nicht nur Mastodon.
    • Bei mir ist das Fediverse auch nicht nur Mastodon mit anderen Sachen (PeerTube, Pixelfed) nachträglich als Extras angeklebt.
    • Bei mir ist Mastodon nicht fully-featured.
    • Ich kritisiere Mastodon offen.
    • Ich schreibe ständig über Sachen im Fediverse, die keiner kennt, schon gar nicht als Teil des Fediverse.
      Und über Sachen, die viele lieber nicht im Fediverse haben wollen, weil die sich zu sehr anders verhalten als Mastodon. Also "falsch".

    Ich bin nämlich selbst gar nicht auf Mastodon. Ich bin auf Hubzilla (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubzilla; https://hubzilla.org; https://joinfediverse.wiki/Hubzilla). Das kann zwar nach Mastodon posten und Inhalte aus Mastodon empfangen, funktioniert aber völlig anders als Mastodon und wird auch immer eine völlig andere Kultur haben.

    #Hashtag, #Hashtags, #HashtagMeta und #CWHashtagMeta für die, die meine Beiträge über Hashtags nicht lesen wollen. Weil Hashtags für mich nicht nur dazu dienen, die eigenen Beiträge leichter auffindbar zu machen, sondern auch dazu, Filter auszulösen. Etwas, was in Mastodons Kultur auch nicht vorkommt.

    Ich schreibe auch noch über andere solche Sachen, die viele Mastodon-Nutzer nicht sehen wollen. Viele auf Mastodon wollen nichts sehen, was nicht auf Linie mit Mastodons Kultur ist.

    Daher will ich ihnen eine Chance geben, diese Inhalte loszuwerden. Und zwar, ohne mich stummzuschalten, zu blockieren oder mir zu sagen, ich soll aufhören, so etwas zu schreiben (werde ich nämlich nicht).

    (1/6)

    #Mastodon #MastodonKultur #MastodonZentrizität #MastodonNormativität #Hubzilla
  12. Ich brauche Hashtags, um bei meinen Lesern die automatische leserseitige Erzeugung von CWs auszulösen, die hier auf Hubzilla schon seit 2015 möglich ist und seit 2022 auch auf Mastodon; CW: langer Post (über 5100 Zeichen), Fediverse-Meta, Fediverse-über-Mastodon-hinaus-Meta, CW-Meta, Hashtag-Meta Artikel ansehen Zusammenfassung ansehen

    @Todos Locos Nur wieviele Hashtags sollen dann maximal erlaubt sein? Vier?

    Ich selbst verwende Hashtags sehr viel, um damit bei meiner Leserschaft Filter auszulösen. Das hat zwei Gründe.

    Zum einen lebe ich hier auf Hubzilla in einer CW-Kultur, die nicht nur sehr viel älter ist als die auf Mastodon, sondern völlig anders: Auf Mastodon ist es üblich, daß CWs schreiberseitig festgelegt und allen Lesern gleichermaßen aufgezwungen werden, ob sie die jetzt brauchen oder nicht.

    Hier auf Hubzilla werden CWs traditionell vollautomatisch generiert, und zwar leserseitig mittels Wortfilter. Jeder kann für sich selbst bestimmen, ob irgendwas versteckt werden soll, und wenn ja, was. Dafür braucht es aber entsprechende Schlüsselwörter in den Beiträgen. Und die lassen sich am besten als Hashtags anfügen; das wirkt viel eleganter, als sie einfach so unten an den Beitrag zu kleben.

    Hubzilla hat dieses Feature seit seiner Entstehung 2015, und es ist zurückzuführen bis zum Start von Friendica 2010.

    Ironischerweise hat Mastodon im Prinzip dieselbe Funktionalität. Nur ist sie auf Mastodon nicht nur viel komplizierter in der Handhabung, sondern Mastodon hat sie erst seit Oktober 2022, als seine CW-Kultur schon für alle Zeiten in Stein gemeißelt war. 99% der Mastodon-Nutzer wissen weder, daß Mastodon dieses Feature hat, noch, daß es irgendwo im Fediverse existiert. (Somit wenden sich die meisten meiner Hashtags an das eine verbleibende Prozent.)

    Dazu kommt dann auch noch, daß Hubzilla so etwas wie Mastodon-CWs nur in Posts erzeugen kann, die keine Antworten sind, nicht aber in Antworten. Das liegt daran, daß Hubzilla mehr wie ein Blog ist als wie Twitter oder Mastodon. Was auf Mastodon eine CW ist, ist auf Hubzilla schon sehr viel länger eine Zusammenfassung, wie es sie auch in Blogs gibt. Aber keine Bloggingplattform der Welt hat Zusammenfassungen für Kommentare. Und Hubzilla sieht Antworten als genau das an: Kommentare. Im Gegensatz zu Mastodon hat Hubzilla auch nicht einen Editor für alles, sondern einen separaten für Antworten, in dem Zusammenfassungen nicht implementiert sind.

    Theoretisch ginge das alternativ mit Tags. Aber Zusammenfassungen/CWs in Kommentaren, die per Tag gebaut werden, funktionieren auf Mastodon nicht; siehe mein Versuch oben.

    Will sagen: Die einzigen CWs, hinter denen ich meine Kommentare verbergen kann, sind solche, die automatisch leserseitig per Wortfilter generiert werden.

    Zum anderen schreibe ich sehr viel, was höchstwahrscheinlich viele andere nicht lesen wollen, was sie also gern gefiltert hätten, evtl. auch hinter einer CW versteckt. Und darauf sind meine Hashtags zu einem erheblichen Teil ausgelegt. Normalerweise habe ich meine Hashtags alle am Ende eines Beitrags, aber zur Demonstration werde ich sie hier direkt einbauen.

    Ein paar Beispiele also, die für diesen Kommentar relevant sind:

    #Long, #LongPost, #CWLong und #CWLongPost entsprechen "CW: langer Post ([i] Zeichen)". Das verwende ich, wenn ich mehr als 500 Zeichen auf einmal poste. #LangerPost und #CWLangerPost sind Erweiterungen für deutschsprachige Posts, damit deutschsprachige Leser nicht irritiert sind. Die Bedeutung ist dieselbe.

    #FediMeta, #FediverseMeta, #CWFediMeta und #CWFediverseMeta entsprechen "CW: Fediverse-Meta", was als tatsächliche CW bei mir normalerweise erweitert ist zu entweder "CW: Fediverse-Meta, Nicht-Mastodon-Fediverse-Meta" oder "CW: Fediverse-Meta, Fediverse-über-Mastodon-hinaus-Meta". Das bedeutet: "CW: Jupiter Rowland schreibt wieder irgendwelchen verqueren Quatsch über das Fediverse, der nicht mit Mastodons Standards und Mastodons Kultur auf Linie ist."

    #CW, #CWs, #CWMeta, #ContentWarning, #ContentWarnings und #ContentWarningMeta entsprechen "CW: Content-Warning-Meta". Das bedeutet: "CW: Jupiter Rowland schreibt wieder irgendwelchen verqueren Quatsch über CWs, der nicht nur nicht mit Mastodons Standards und Mastodons Kultur auf Linie ist, sondern mit der technischen Realität im Mastodon-Fediverse nicht das Geringste zu tun hat." So wie da oben gerade.

    #Hashtag, #Hashtags, #HashtagMeta und #CWHashtagMeta entsprechen "CW: Hashtag-Meta". Das bedeutet: "CW: Jupiter Rowland schreibt wieder irgendwelchen verqueren Quatsch über Hashtags und wie sie auf Mastodon niemand jemals anwendet. Nichts davon ist auch nur in der Nähe von Mastodons Standards und Mastodons Kultur."

    Dabei stehen die Hashtags mit "CW" als Zeichen dafür, daß sie eben die Funktion einer CW haben bzw. die leserseitige Erzeugung einer CW auslösen sollen.

    Dann hätte ich noch andere Hashtags, in diesem Fall #Hubzilla, #MastodonKultur, #MastodonZentrizität und #MastodonNormativität. In diesem Fall sind das die einzigen, die dazu dienen, meinen Kommentar auffindbar zu machen.

    Sie haben aber noch eine zweite Funktion: Man kann sie anklicken oder antippen und noch mehr Beiträge mit demselben Hashtag finden. Wenn man z. B. keine Ahnung hat, was Hubzilla ist: einfach #Hubzilla anklicken/antippen und durch die Beiträge scrollen, dann bekommt man evtl. schon mal eine grobe Idee. Noch etwas übrigens, wovon scheinbar sehr viele auf Mastodon nicht wissen, daß das geht.
  13. @Nicolas Mouart noPhD, noMA No. I'm someone who wants to write image descriptions and alt-text not somehow, but the best way I can.

    For this, I've been gathering information from a whole lot of sources for more than three years. More recently, I've started compiling it in a wiki so I can share it with others. When the wiki is done, it will have over 30 individual rules and guidelines for describing images and writing alt-texts.

    125 characters as a limit are widespread because screen readers used to have a 125-character hard cap at some point in the 2010s or so. They simply couldn't read alt-texts beyond the 125-character mark. A while later, the hard limit was raised to 200 characters.

    Nowadays, there is no hard character limit in screen readers to speak of anymore. Mastodon user @Eric Eggert says so, too: https://yatil.net/blog/there-is-no-character-limit-for-alt-text

    The lowest actual character limit that must be heeded in the Fediverse is 512 characters. It is imposed by Misskey, a microblogging server application that's part of the Fediverse and fully federated with Mastodon, but more powerful than Mastodon (https://misskey-hub.net/en/; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misskey), as well as its various forks and forks of forks such as Calckey (defunct, but servers still exist), Firefish (ditto), Iceshrimp-JS, Sharkey, Catodon or CherryPick.

    By design, Misskey is supposed to truncate alt-texts that are longer than 512 characters at the 512-character mark. However, due to a bug that still isn't fixed, it deletes the alt-text instead. The same applies to all the "Forkeys". If you write a longer alt-text, users on Misskey and the Forkeys will believe you haven't supplied an alt-text to begin with. You take a big effort upon you and write this monster of an alt-text, and regardless, users on Misskey, Sharkey & Co. will think you're another ableist swine who can't be bothered.

    The only other thing that speaks against the 1000+-character alt-texts that are so popular on Mastodon is simply useability: A screen reader can navigate normal text, i.e. "rewind" a few words or to the beginning of the sentence of whatever. It can't navigate alt-text in this way, though. So let's suppose you're having a 1000-character alt-text read out to you. Around the 900-character mark, something distracts you. You have to have the last sentence re-read. No dice. The only thing the screen reader can do is jump back to the beginning of the alt-text and re-read the whole thing.

    Still, Mastodon, being as Mastodon-centric as it has always been, loves long alt-texts. For one, it loves to use alt-texts to write around the 500-character limit which, by the way, is very bad.

    But it also appears to love long and detailed image descriptions. They appear to have become part of Mastodon's culture. I'm actually waiting for Fediverse users being sanctioned in some way for providing alt-texts that adhere to Web accessibility standards, but that are too short for at least some Mastodon users' standards. In fact, I'm waiting for the first Mastodon user sanctioning someone else because they consider an alt-text of 500 characters too short and lacking details.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Calckey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #IceshrimpJS #Sharkey #Catodon #CherryPick #MastodonCulture #MastodonCentricity #MastodonNormativity #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta
  14. @Nicolas Mouart noPhD, noMA As for the character limit, that's because Gemini is sourcing old and outdated information of which it doesn't know that it's old and outdated.

    I'm working on an extensive wiki about image descriptions and alt-texts for the Fediverse. This is the page about how long alt-text can and should be: https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/wiki/jupiter_rowland/How(20)to(20)describe(20)images(20)in(20)the(20)Fediverse/How(20)long(20)can(20)alt-text(20)be(3f)

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta
  15. @Frank Paul Silye Some have switched to self-hosted lightweight microblogging applications such as GoToSocial or snac.

    Some have upgraded to something like Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Firefish, Iceshrimp or Sharkey. A few have even taken the big step up to Friendica or even Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte.

    And then there are those who have left the Fediverse altogether and moved to the ATmosphere, mostly Bluesky.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #GoToSocial #snac #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #Sharkey #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #ATmosphere #Bluesky
  16. @fedi (ツ) Es soll nur "sehr große Online-Plattformen" (VLOPs) und "sehr große Online-Suchmaschinen" (VLOSEs) betreffen. Also in Größenordnungen von zig Millionen monatlich aktiven Usern.

    https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/policies/list-designated-vlops-and-vloses

    Selbst wenn das Fediverse als Ganzes als eine zusammenhängende Plattform angesehen wird, kommt es nicht annähernd in diese Dimensionen.

    Und das Fediverse wird nicht als Ganzes als eine zusammenhängende Plattform angesehen. Das geht gar nicht, und das wird auch die EU-Kommission begreifen. Denn es gibt niemanden, der zentral für das ganze Fediverse verantwortlich ist. Das Fediverse hat nicht eine ladungsfähige Adresse, sondern zigtausende.

    Wir reden hier eher über weit über 45.000 Einzel-"Plattformen". Zugegeben, davon kann man diejenigen Anwendungen abziehen, die eh nur Einzelnutzeranwendungen sind, wie die gut 10.000 Ghost-Instanzen. Die EU-Kommission müßte trotzdem jeden verbleibenden Server einzeln überprüfen und jeden Serverbetreiber einzeln juristisch zur Rechenschaft ziehen.

    Selbst mastodon.social ist mit gut 720.000 monatlich aktiven Usern weit davon entfernt, eine VLOP zu sein, und winzige Server kaum bekannter Fediverse-Anwendungen erst recht.

    Die EU-Kommission wird kein Riesenfaß aufmachen, weil ein öffentlicher Forte-Server mit Freizeitadmin und fünf monatlich aktiven Usern keine wirksame Alterskontrolle hat. Das Resultat, wenn es denn eins gibt, rechtfertigt den bürokratischen, juristischen und letztlich monetären Aufwand nicht.

    Man muß sich einfach mal überlegen: Wieviel Aufwand ist es für die EU, eine "Online-Plattform" wegen unzureichender oder fehlender Alterskontrolle zur Rechenschaft zu ziehen? Wie lange dauert das, was bindet das an Personal, was kostet das?

    So, und selbst wenn wir im Fediverse nur Server mit mindestens zehn aktiven Usern pro Monat betrachten, überlegen wir uns mal, was es für ein Aufwand wäre, das gut 3.600x zu machen. Wenn wir jeden Server jeder Software betrachten, die mehrere User auf einem Server ermöglicht (also auch WordPress, wo die Mehrzahl der Instanzen Einzelblogs sind, aber öffentliche Bloggingserver technisch möglich sind), sind wir weit im fünfstelligen Bereich.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #KidsAct
  17. @Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸 They don't.

    First of all, that'd require searching the entire Fediverse for accounts and channels that have blocked you. Your Mastodon account has no records of who has blocked you, that's why searching is necessary.

    Also, it'd require remotely re-writing the block settings on accounts and channels of every Fediverse software, from Mastodon to Hubzilla which works absolutely nothing like Mastodon internally.

    Lastly, next to the huge effort, that'd simply be a stupid idea.

    Even nomadic identity (https://joinfediverse.wiki/Nomadic_identity) doesn't provide this feature. That has to say something.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Hubzilla #NomadicIdentity #Block #BlockMeta #CWBlockMeta
  18. @Jill ☁️ @Friedemann Das stimmt nicht so ganz. Hubzilla hat die Hubzilla Association, an die man sich wenden kann. Zu der gehört auch einer der beiden Kernentwickler.

    Offizielle Website (als Ausgangspunkt): https://hubzilla.org/

    Hubzilla Association: https://hubzilla.org/page/info/association

    Impressum der Hubzilla Association: https://hubzilla.org/page/info/imprint

    #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Hubzilla #HubzillaAssociation
  19. @The Real Grunfink Hubzilla is against AI-generated code in the core, too. AI-generated third-party add-ons exist, but they're in third-party repositories.

    However, what people are looking for is a full software stack that's as 100% completely devoid of any and all AI-generated code as it used to be five years ago.

    And they're not willing to make any compromises. Much, much less even than the opponents against Wayland, PipeWire, PulseAudio, systemd, KDE since version 4, Canonical, anything that isn't licensed under any version of the GPL or any software that has ever gone through Richard M. Stallman's hands.

    Even if it's possible to use Fediverse server software that's guaranteed to be 100% devoid of AI code and remain so forever, there's no kernel, no userland, no Web server and no database server (which most Fediverse server applications need) that's guaranteed to be 100% devoid of AI code and remain so forever.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hubzilla #AI #LLM #LLMs #NoAI #AntiAI
  20. @sb  the chippy-choppy There won't be many left. Depending on how staunchly and extremely anti-AI you and (aspiring) server admins are, there won't be any left. Because it's technically impossible to set up a Fediverse server with absolutely no AI code underneath whatsoever.

    The Linux mainline kernel itself contains AI code now. It's officially allowed as long as it's disclosed as such. Thus, you will have to avoid literally all servers running on Linux.

    https://docs.kernel.org/process/coding-assistants.html

    https://www.neowin.net/news/linus-torvalds-declares-massive-ai-fueled-code-surges-as-the-new-normal-for-linux/

    NetBSD has very strict rules regarding AI-generated code. But it doesn't rule AI-generated code out out of principle because it's AI-generated; it only wants to be safe that nothing that's actually GPL-licensed is slipped in. So, if you're an 100%, ultra-hardcode anti-AI extremist, avoid what few servers run on NetBSD.

    https://www.netbsd.org/developers/commit-guidelines.html

    OpenBSD contains AI-generated code, too. And it has no official stance regarding it. So servers running on OpenBSD are taboo, too.

    https://www.osnews.com/story/144935/openbsd-and-slopcode-raindrop-to-a-torrent/

    FreeBSD has no stance on AI whatsoever that I could find. However, apparently, the FreeBSD community loves to integrate Claude Code into their systems for automation purposes:

    https://aumont.fr/posts/claude-code-freebsd/

    https://discoverbsd.com/p/8a7660c31b

    But you'll also have to look at the userland, the Web server, the database driver etc.

    MariaDB allows AI code. You can safely assume that all MySQL databases on Web servers out there are actually powered by MariaDB.

    https://mariadb.org/governance/governance-ai-policy/

    Oracle MySQL can integrate AI, so it's safe to assume it contains AI-generated code.

    https://blogs.oracle.com/mysql/announcing-mysql-ai

    PostgreSQL probably allows AI code, too. There are even tools for it.

    https://github.com/timescale/pg-aiguide

    SQLite is very popular amongst AI users while not having any rules on AI-generated code. Assume it to be tainted.

    This leaves you with only one choice: Self-hosting a personal, single-user snac2 server because snac2 doesn't need any database whatsoever. In fact, snac2 is staunchly against AI. And it runs on NetBSD.

    https://codeberg.org/grunfink/snac2

    But then there's the Web server. Apache may allow AI-generated code if it has been reviewed and made sure that it does not contain anything that's incompatible with the Apache-2.0 license.

    https://www.apache.org/legal/generative-tooling.html

    nginx welcomes AI and advertises itself as ready for AI, and it takes no anti-AI-code stance. It's most likely already tainted.

    https://www.f5.com/de_de/products/nginx.

    This basically leaves you with no Web server guaranteed to be 100% free from AI-generated code to run snac2 on. But that doesn't matter because it's impossible to build a Web server devoid of any AI code to install snac2 on.

    By the way: Mastodon itself explicitly allows AI code if it's disclosed as such, and if its contributor understands it.

    https://github.com/mastodon/.github/blob/main/AI_POLICY.md

    In other words, next to all Mastodon servers are running
    • AI-generated Mastodon code
    • on an AI-generated Web server
    • with an AI-generated database driver
    • on an AI-generated operating system kernel

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Linux #FreeBSD #OpenBSD #NetBSD #Apache #nginx #MySQL #MariaDB #PostgreSQL #SQLite #Mastodon #snac2 #AI #LLM #LLMs #GenAI #NoAI #AntiAI #AntiLLM
  21. @happyborg
    People can follow hashtags

    People on Mastodon can follow hashtags. But just because people on Mastodon can, doesn't mean people everywhere else in the Fediverse can, too.

    AFAIK, some of the minimalist microblogging server applications designed for self-hosting don't offer this feature. I'm not sure if Pleroma and Akkoma have it.

    Hubzilla, which is what I'm commenting from, definitely doesn't have this feature. And Hubzilla is anything but minimalist. It's the most powerful and versatile of all Fediverse server applications.

    Also, if you can follow hashtags, you can only follow hashtags on your home server. But if you're on a small server, hardly any messages with these hashtags wash up there in the first place. You'll miss a lot. If you're on a private, single-user server, following hashtags is completely useless because the only messages with these hashtags that reach the server are those that you receive from your own contacts anyway.

    (streams) and Forte, both being streamlined and more advanced Hubzilla descendants, can follow hashtags. But there simply aren't any big (streams) or Forte servers, especially not with lots of traffic from Mastodon. Most of the few (streams) and Forte users run their own single-user servers.

    This is also why it doesn't matter much whether snac or GoToSocial users can follow hashtags: These two are almost exclusively used as private, single-user servers because that's what they're designed for first and foremost.

    To make it short: Most Fediverse users outside the big Mastodon servers can only follow hashtags by relying on "bots" that forward posts with these hashtags which they find on e.g. mastodon.social.

    In fact, this is good for Mastodon users as well. It helps circumvent two of Mastodon's disadvantages.

    One is that it has no support for groups whatsoever (the Fediverse does have groups in case you don't know). If Mastodon users need to talk about a certain topic, they can't do so in a group about that topic. All they can do is shout into the ether with certain hashtags and hope that the right person catches their toot.

    The other one is that this is highly unlikely on Mastodon itself. On Mastodon, most content remains unseen.

    Mastodon doesn't offer a list of unread messages in the timeline, not even a counter. All that Mastodon users can do is scroll down their timeline until they either hit content that they've already seen, or until they've got no more time, or until they want no more. Anything below will remain unseen. It's sad that this counts as the default or even without alternatives in the Fediverse. And most Mastodon users follow so many accounts and channels (plus hashtags occasionally) that they can impossibly read all the messages they receive.

    Let's suppose a Mastodon user wants to talk about Hubzilla for some reason. I've seen this happen often enough. The only chance they have, not knowing that the @hubzilla exists, much less that they can join it from Mastodon, is by tooting into the void with the hashtag #Hubzilla and hoping that either one of their followers or someone somewhere out there on their followers' servers follows the hashtag #Hubzilla.

    But none of their followers comes online soon enough to scroll down to their toot. They all have tons of other content in their timelines above that toot, so they never scroll all the way down to it. If not, they simply don't know what Hubzilla is. And even if any Mastodon users follow the hashtag #Hubzilla (which I doubt), this still doesn't mean that one of them scrolls all the way down to that toot.

    And then there's me. As I've already said, I'm on Hubzilla. I can't follow hashtags directly. Instead, I "follow" the hashtag #Hubzilla by having this hashtag on the FediBuzz relay (https://relay.fedi.buzz/) as a contact. Or, in Mastodon terms, by following it. FediBuzz is not a bot server. It's a relay that server admins can connect their servers to to have more public content on their servers (if their server software supports relays, that is). Something completely normal on Mastodon, especially on small servers.

    So when someone on Mastodon toots something with #Hubzilla, I receive it as a new post. But I don't have to scroll down a timeline of unknown length to find it. I have a counter for unread messages and other unnoticed actions. It unfolds into a list of unread messages and other unnoticed actions. From there, I can get directly to that post. I will notice it. And I'll usually be able to help.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hashtag #Hashtags #HashtagMeta #CWHashtagMeta #Relay #Relays
  22. @Alexander Goeres 𒀯 @everton137 Whether they've adopted Mastodon's culture. And whether they follow all of Mastodon's largely unwritten rules to a tee.

    Regardless of whether or not they're actually on Mastodon after all.

    #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #MastodonCulture #MastodonHOA #MastodonCentricity #MastodonNormativity
  23. @silverpill @🫧 Social coding commons @Rimu @elle And this has to say something.

    After all, Mastodon is far from a by-the-book implementation. Mastodon's ActivityPub implementation is influenced by two things. One, the legacy compatibility decisions from a time when Mastodon had two base protocols, OStatus and ActivityPub, and it had to make ActivityPub work like OStatus. Two, Mastodon's willingness to combat the Fediverse and eventually EEE it rather than embracing it.

    Let me put it this way: At least for the longest time, Mastodon has tried hard to be incompatible with large parts of the Fediverse, at least with those parts that don't appear like add-ons to Mastodon (like PeerTube or Pixelfed).

    And it has reached its goal: Almost all of those on Mastodon who do know that the Fediverse is more than Mastodon think that Mastodon still is the reference implementation of ActivityPub, and everything that doesn't work exactly like Mastodon, or that causes friction when interacting with Mastodon, is broken. That's one way to get rid of competition: Make it look bad to your own users.

    Entire features, some of which are backed by FEPs, are bad from a Mastodon point of view. For example, enclosed threaded conversations with one post and otherwise comments, as can be found all over the Fediverse from Friendica and its descendants to the whole Threadiverse, are bad because they're so different from Mastodon's threads loosely tied together from toots and more toots. And there's an FEP for them: FEP-171b "Conversation Containers".

    This has gotten so bad especially since the big Twitter exodus from 2022 that developers no longer implement ActivityPub; to quote a diaspora* developer, they "implement Mastodon". They build their stuff hard against Mastodon with little to no regards for actual ActivityPub and with little to no regards for the rest of the Fediverse.

    Even Mike Macgirvin, formerly the staunchest Mastodon critic under the sun, has given in. He has added a per-post switch to (streams) and Forte which lets you choose between starting an enclosed conversation as per FEP-171b that Mastodon doesn't properly understand and starting a Mastodon-style loose thread that Mastodon understands.

    I mean, what kind of "decentralised" Fediverse is it if the W3C is powerless, if the SWICG is effectively powerless, if the other devs are powerless, too, because it's Gargron and his Mastodon developers who are the one and only authority that defines how the Fediverse has to be built? And when Mastodon decides to re-invent the wheel once more, the whole rest of the Fediverse has to throw away its existing wheels and implement Mastodon's not even necessarily better wheels?

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #ActivityPub #Mastodon #MastodonCentricity #MastodonNormativity
  24. @silverpill @🫧 Social coding commons @Rimu @elle I guess I can accurately estimate on which side Mastodon is standing. Even though Mastodon can be considered "real ActivityPub" and "implemented".

    #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #ActivityPub
  25. CW: DI.DAY September 2026: Tanz durch die Instanzen; CW: lang (fast 1200 Zeichen), Fediverse-Meta, Fediverse-über-Mastodon-hinaus-Meta, Quote-Post
    Hat von euch Nicht-Mastodon-Fediverse-Leuten, bei denen BigBlueButton geht, jemand Sonntag von 16 bis 18 Uhr Zeit?

    RE: https://rz-social.de/@gal1le0/117185573856020567

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #DI.Day #DigitalIndependenceDay
  26. @Mark Wyner Won’t Comply :vm: First of all, you completely forgot the social media posters. The TOC link leads nowhere.

    Also, maybe it's fair to mention that I'm working on an entire wiki about alt-texts and image descriptions, especially for the Fediverse. 46 pages are planned as of now, 24 of them are already written. These will include over 30 pages on how to do things, how not to do things and what never to do at all.

    I won't add step-by-step guides for certain frontends. But I've already started adding rules and guidelines for how to describe images appropriately and write alt-texts in a way that won't break stuff anywhere.

    Even if it's a very incomplete WIP, it's unique in several ways:
    • It's the only wiki about alt-texts and image descriptions. Few writers have even only written multiple pages or articles on this subject.
    • It's the only guide that takes the existence of the Fediverse outside of Mastodon into consideration. This means that it's also the only guide that doesn't assume that Fediverse equals always having only 500 characters for the message text. It actually recommends an additional, longer image description in the message text in certain situations, regardless of whether or not vanilla Mastodon users can do that.
    • It's the only guide that, instead of regurgitating the alt-text rules for webpages and blogs and assuming that they apply to the Fediverse just the same, talks about the peculiarities of posting images into the Fediverse, how Mastodon's alt-text quality criteria are different from the W3C WAI and WCAG alt-text quality criteria, and why it's critically important to know and fulfill Mastodon's requirements for good alt-texts.
    • It's probably the only guide that doesn't assume that you can always precisely target a certain audience for your content and make sure that only those receive it who understand it right off the bat.
    • It is the only guide that lists over 60 references, including your blog post, but also including university webpages as well as over two dozen guides from Veronica Lewis a.k.a. Veronica with Four Eyes.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta
  27. @Hirad @Mehrad :kde: :emacs: :rstats: Which is curious, seeing as the GNU FM developer also started GNU social and scooped up StatusNet's abandoned code to merge it into GNU social. The idea was to use GNU social in some way to make GNU FM federate.

    GNU social even implemented ActivityPub at some point, but GNU FM never did. Now GNU social is dead anyway.

    #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #GNUFM #GNUsocial
  28. @🌴 Seph 💭 👾 That's one nice thing about Hubzilla: You can customise the UI apart from theming. You can completely change the layout. (Not sure if you can do that with Saiwal's themes, but you can with Redbasic.)

    By default, a new channel has barely got any icons in the navbar and not even that many in the app menu. The right-hand end of the navbar of a new channel only contains icons for search, HQ, help and the app menu. You can configure under Apps which icons shall appear where. Star them, and they're in the menu. Pin them, and they're on the navbar.

    In fact, whereas (I think) Friendica has all its features on all the time, Hubzilla is very modular. Many of its features are optional and off by default; they're called "apps". If you don't need it, don't activate it, and you won't have UI elements for it.

    Even the various pages can be rearranged in the PDL editor. You don't need something, throw it out. You only need one sidebar, choose a layout with only one sidebar instead of both. You can do without any sidebars, pick a layout without sidebars.

    Saiwal's theme previews have to show what can be done with them. Hence, a lot of UI elements are in place that either can be configured away or have to be configured into place in the first place.

    For example, if you look at the AdminLTE preview: You only have to pin the apps that you need all the time. If you want to, you can unpin them all, and they're gone. But then you'll have to go via the Featured Apps menu to get to them. You can slim that down as well, but then you have to open the Apps page to get to them.

    The entire wide dark navigation bar on the left can be folded in if you don't need it. Fold it out when you need it.

    Main Navigation looks like a homebrew element that doesn't necessarily have to be default. The Archives field can be configured away or has to be configured into place.

    The buttons below the posts can't be reduced that much. The speech bubble unfolds the comments. Then come thumb up and (optional, off-by-default) thumb down. Next comes repeat (= share on Friendica). The smiley is for replying with nothing but one emoticon; I think this is actually an optional feature, too.

    Now, when I look at the Solidified preview: Almost every other button on the left-hand bar is for an app that isn't even activated by default. Most of the rest are for features that are available right away, but their buttons usually aren't.

    Most of what's on the right was probably configured in for the showcase. Even if it's there by default, it can be removed.

    The centre only seems cluttered because the posts are arranged across three columns instead of all in one. Even there you can choose how to arrange the posts.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #UtsuktaThemes #AdminLTE #Solidified #Hubzilla
  29. @🌴 Seph 💭 👾 Have you taken a look at Hubzilla yet?

    It was created by the same guy as Friendica, and it's a descendent of Friendica. (Forked to Free-Friendika, then forked to Red, both in 2011, then largely rewritten against a brand-new protocol in 2012, then renamed Red Matrix, then greatly expanded in features and renamed Hubzilla in 2015.)

    One could say it's Friendica
    • entirely running on its own protocol, Zot6
    • with nomadic identity that makes it possible to clone your channel across multiple servers and making it resilient against server outage
    • with multiple channel (identities, like complete Friendica accounts, but without separate logins) on one account/login, and you can switch between them without logging out and back in again (all with multiple profiles like on Friendica)
    • without Bluesky integration
    • with less pandering to Mastodon
    • with an even better permissions system
    • with full (client-side and server-side) OpenWebAuth support
    • with polls
    • with WebDAV access to your file space
    • with a built-in CalDAV calendar server
    • with an optional built-in CardDAV addressbook server
    • with optional articles, planning cards, wikis and webpages
    • with a very extensive, detailed and well-written built-in help system
    • with the ability to integrate git repositories with 3rd-party add-ons and themes that can even be upgraded with shell scripts as easily as the whole hub
    • with 3rd-party themes available that change the entire UI and UX instead of reskinning the existing UI, especially the Utsukta themes by @Saiwal

    It does not provide any previews for links, though I'm sure something like this can be developed as a third-party addon.

    If you want to try it, it's quite tricky to find a good hub with 3rd-party themes installed to start on. There aren't any in North America; don't go looking for them.

    You may want to get in touch with @pepe about joining his Whoville hub. It's well-equipped, it's well-maintained, but keep in mind it's in Europe.

    If you find Hubzilla to your liking, and you want to have your own hub hosted, there appear to be quite a few Hubzilla hosting services. Pick one you like, set up your own hub, activate the add-ons you need, install the third-party themes and add-ons you need, get it to run properly, and then clone your daily-driver production channel over from Whoville. Make the instance on your own hub the main one, and keep the one at Whoville as a clone in case your hoster is offline, or something else is wrong with your hub.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Friendica #Hubzilla
  30. @silverpill @Rimu @elle I could come up with a bunch of conspiracy theories for this behaviour.

    Enforcement of Mastodon dominance.

    A front against Mike Macgirvin, inventor of the most "disruptive" Fediverse software from a Mastodon point of view, as well as all his creations and inventions.

    Forcing a grass-roots development under corporate control and eradicating the grass-roots part. Essentially "embrace-extend-extinguish", but trying desperately to speed-run the "embrace" and "extend" parts to cut to the "extinguish" part as quickly as possible.

    The only way this could possibly fail is if Mastodon decided not to play along because more people consider Mastodon the ActivityPub reference implementation and Fediverse gold standard than not.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #ActivityPub
  31. @น้อย คงคะดี First of all, Mastodon offers you 1,500 characters per alt-text. Not 10,000.

    Otherwise, no. No, you absolutely shouldn't.

    It isn't uncommon among Mastodon users to say, "Okay, we've only got 500 characters in our toots which we also need for mentions and hashtags and even CWs. But we've got 1,500 characters per alt-text! So let's use the alt-texts to expand our character limits!"

    What next to nobody on Mastodon knows: Not everyone can access alt-text. There are people who can't, and for whom everything only written in alt-text is lost forever.

    Accessing alt-text either requires a screen reader or at least one hand that's working properly enough. You have to hold a phone, or you have to click something, or you have to hover a mouse cursor over the image.

    But there are people who are sighted enough that they don't need a screen reader, so they don't have one. At the same time, however, they don't have any sufficiently working hands. Or they don't have hands at all because both their hands were amputated after some accident.

    And yet, they can operate a computer. They control it entirely by keyboard. With a headpointer, if need be (a pen strapped to their forehead with which they poke the keys, one by one).

    If you write something into the alt-text and only into the alt-text, none of these people will ever be able to read it.

    If you really need more characters, then you've got two options.

    If you absolutely must stay on Mastodon (because you like the UI, or because you're on an iPhone, and you absolutely must use your favourite Mastodon phone app), you can ask around for servers with a higher character limit.

    If you only want to stay in the Fediverse and connected to Mastodon users, and it doesn't have to be Mastodon, but you don't want to go through the hassle of looking for servers with over 500 characters, you can move to, for example
    • Akkoma (5,000 characters; can be configured by the admin, so the actual limit may be higher)
    • Misskey (3,000 characters; hard-coded)
    • Sharkey or CherryPick (3,000 characters; can be configured by the admin, so the actual limit may be higher)
    • Friendica or Hubzilla (16,777,215 characters; limited by the maximum size of the message text database field)

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #Akkoma #Misskey #Sharkey #CherryPick #Friendica #Hubzilla #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #Inclusion #A11y #Accessibility
  32. @Mika When I read the Bonfire suggestion, I was about to suggest Hubzilla, the most powerful Fediverse server application.

    In case you don't know it: It basically evolved in 2015 from a fork of a Friendica fork, and it was created by Friendica's inventor. It probably has one of the best user documentations in the Fediverse, but it also has quite a steep learning curve, and newly created channels require quite a bit of configuration before you can really use them.

    The same guy still maintains two more recent members of the same software family, (streams) from 2021 and Forte from 2024. They aren't quite as blistering with features as Hubzilla (they lack all the CMS stuff: articles, cards, wikis, webpages), and they don't offer nearly as many connection options as Friendica and Hubzilla.

    Although they're still somehow complex, and although they don't have much of a user documentation, I dare say they're easier to get into because they don't require quite as much undocumented initial configuration after creating a channel.

    All three offer groups (Hubzilla calls them "forums"), but no subforums. Whereas Friendica groups can only be co-administered by someone on the same server, groups/forums on Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte can be co-administered by anyone on Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte.

    However, there aren't any phone apps for them. They can be installed as progressive Web apps, though, and their Web UIs transform into mobile mode quite well AFAIK.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte
  33. CW: How must foreign-language text be transcribed in an image description? CW: long (over 2,200 characters), alt-text meta, image description meta
    I'm pretty sure that posting this will turn out completely futile. But I'll try anyway.

    I'm especially asking the Mastodon alt-text enforcers: How must foreign-language text be transcribed, both by Web accessibility standards and by Mastodon's alt-text standards?

    Let's assume I have some text in an image that's in a different language than the post and therefore in a different language than the image description. But I still have to transcribe it.

    Now, according to image-describing rules, text must always be transcribed 100% verbatim. Word by word, character by character, exactly identical to the original in the image.

    Here's the catch: Screen reader software may not be able to reliably switch the language in which they read out text in the middle of a description. They definitely cannot switch the language in the middle of an alt-text, I know that, just like they cannot navigate within alt-text.

    This means that if I describe an image in English, but there's French text somewhere, a screen reader may read it out as gobbledygook instead of proper French. It may read the French text like it's English.

    But even if the screen reader did read out the French text in proper French, someone who doesn't understand French won't understand the text.

    This leaves me with two options:
    • Transcribe the foreign-language text verbatim, add a translation afterwards.
      This would make the foreign-language text understandable, but it would also produce gobbledygook.
    • Give a translated transcript of the foreign-language text that's as close to the original as possible.
      No gobbledygook, but I'd break the rule of always transcribing text verbatim.

    The latter option would produce weird results if applied to a sign with essentially the same text in French, English and German where the French and German texts translate into something that slightly differs from both each other and the English text. I've happened upon this before.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #Transcript #Transcripts #ScreenReader #ScreenReaders #ForeignLanguage #Inclusion #A11y #Accessibility
  34. @Prof. Rachel Thorn 🍉🇺🇦🏳️‍⚧️🏳️ Just out of curiosity: Are there any good excuses for not having added an alt-text that you'd accept?

    For example, when someone new to Hubzilla tells you that they neither know what alt-text is nor how to add it? Hubzilla doesn't have dedicated UI elements for adding alt-texts. Images are embedded into posts like in blog posts rather than attached as files like on Mastodon. Alt-texts have to be manually woven into the image-embedding phpBB code, and the newbie might not know that this is explained in Hubzilla's built-in help, or it's simply too tedious to "program" an alt-text in.

    Or when a Hubzilla veteran of over ten years tells you that Hubzilla has no way whatsoever to add an alt-text to a video? Like images, videos are embedded into posts. But the video-embedding code has no option for an alt-text. Granted, if it's a video, I'd rather expect or supply a full, time-coded transcript in the message text. But maybe what's expected is both a full, time-coded transcript and an alt-text that's sufficiently detailed by Mastodon's standards.

    If neither of these are acceptable to you, there's something else you should know: Hubzilla does not support Mastodon's report feature either because that's a non-standard, homegrown Mastodon feature, and Hubzilla is not built against Mastodon. So if you report someone to their Hubzilla admin, the admin simply will never receive your report.

    This is likely to lead Mastodon users into believing that either the server on the other end is unmoderated (which, in Hubzilla's case and by Mastodon's standards, is technically true because Hubzilla is all about self-moderation), or the admin doesn't care, both of which, by Mastodon's standards, is reason enough to have the server Fediblocked.

    Again, I'm just being curious and cautious. You should not believe that I'm trying to weasel myself out of having to describe images.

    After all, I'm working on an extensive wiki about image descriptions and alt-texts in the Fediverse with 50+ pages with dozens of webpages and blog posts on how to describe images. I'm using the same knowledge that I'm pouring into the wiki, the same rules and guidelines that already have or will have wiki pages, to describe my own images, even though some of them collide with each other and with Mastodon's image description preferences and quality standards. I don't think anyone else in the Fediverse is taking describing images more seriously.

    I rarely post images anymore due to the effort involved. But whenever I do, I take all the effort that's needed to both describe and explain them, taking into consideration the context, Mastodon's culture and preferences regarding alt-texts and image descriptions, the potential target audience and what knowledge they may or may not have about what's in the image. I've declared all my existing image descriptions outdated, also because it'd be too tedious to go and upgrade them all whenever I learn something new about describing images. (Don't go looking for my most recent images on this channel; I post my images elsewhere now because Hubzilla can't make Mastodon blur sensitive images.)

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #Hubzilla #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta
  35. @silverpill @julian In addition, more particularly, it appeared highly unlikely that Mastodon would ever implement something first implemented in the "Anti-Mastodons". The Fediverse server applications that are the farthest from Mastodon while still largely being capable of the same things as Mastodon. Mastodon's nemeses, so-to-speak. The stuff created by the guy who speaks out the most radically against what Mastodon does.

    #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta
  36. @Martin Rundkvist I've written an article with several feature comparison tables between
    • Mastodon
    • Friendica
    • Hubzilla (rebuilt from a fork of a fork of Friendica by Friendica's creator)
    • (streams) (fork of a fork of three forks of a fork (of a fork?) of Hubzilla by the same creator)
    • Forte (fork of the streams repository by still the same creator

    https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/item/0a75de76-eb27-4149-b708-f20b2f79d392

    A few goodies:

    • Mastodon:
      500 characters; requires source code modifications to get more
      Friendica:
      16,777,215 characters
    • Friendica:
      Can render and create the full gamut of HTML text formatting
      Mastodon:
      Can only create plain text; can only render a small subset of HTML text formatting
    • Friendica:
      Have as many images pro post as you want
      Embed them within the text
      Mastodon:
      Limited to 4 images
      Images can only be file attachments
    • Friendica:
      Shows you all content in the Fediverse just like the author intended it
      Mastodon:
      "Sanitises" away half the formatting, all embedded images and all images except for the first four, just for the sake of purist microblogging
    • Mastodon:
      Timeline consists of single messages with no context
      Friendica:
      Timeline consists of complete conversations, all the way back to the start post, with all branches (ignores and blocks notwithstanding)
    • Mastodon:
      Conversations consist of toots and more toots, loosely strung together with mentions
      Replies only reach those who are visibly mentioned
      Friendica:
      Conversations consist of exactly one post and otherwise comments
      Replies go from the replier to the thread starter and from there to all participants in the conversation without having to mention anyone
    • Friendica:
      Has groups built in (groups are accounts with special settings)
      Mastodon:
      Has no support for groups whatsoever, much less its own groups
      Most Mastodon users don't even know that the Fediverse has groups
    • Friendica:
      Lets you federate with the whole Fediverse
      Lets you federate with diaspora*
      Lets you include and remote-control a Bluesky account
      At least used to be able to do the same with a Tumblr account or a Twitter account
      Lets you crosspost to Dreamwidth, Libertree, LiveJournal and XML-RPC-based blogs like WordPress
      Mastodon:
      Just barely so federates with the Fediverse
      Tries to make everything that isn't Mastodon look broken
      Would love for the Fediverse to be only Mastodon
    • Mastodon:
      Makes the whole Fediverse look like Mastodon
      Friendica:
      Shows you which server software a message came from

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #Mastodon #Friendica
  37. @/dev/urandom This would actually be quite counter-productive if it was hard-coded, especially on Mastodon.

    See, the Fediverse can create content that Mastodon can't even properly display. Or rather, stubbornly refuses to display because of its self-imposed limitations.

    Commercial news platforms like Ghost and Flipboard, specialised long-form blogging applications like WordPress, WriteFreely and Plume, the "Facebook-style social networking" side in the shape of Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte, they can all send messages into the Fediverse that make use of all formatting tricks in the HTML book and then some. But if Mastodon, with whichever frontend, were to display them, it would often completely and utterly deface them.

    Mastodon has no support for titles, at least not in messages which it actually displays. It pretends they don't exist.

    Mastodon has no support for ordered lists with numbers or letters. It changes them into bullet-point lists.

    Mastodon has no support for tables, for horizontal rules, for text colours, for text sizes except in headlines etc. It "sanitises" them into plain, unformatted text entirely.

    Most importantly, Mastodon has no support for embedded images and for more than four images in one message.

    For example, let's assume someone writes a beautiful travel blog post on WordPress with the ActivityPub add-on activated. The post has ten images embedded between paragraphs with the paragraphs referencing the images.

    If Mastodon tried to render this blog post, it would rip all images out of the text where they should be embedded. If you're lucky, it would hang four of these images up underneath the post and silently discard the other six so you'll never know they exist. If you're unlucky, Mastodon would silently discard all ten images.

    This, by the way, is the very reason that it's good that Mastodon usually "displays" such posts with their title, their summary and a link to the original that'll open at its source in your Web browser. It'll allow you to see the post as it was intended by the author. Mastodon itself won't.

    At the very least, the links in such Mastodon-generated "previews" must continue to lead to their sources and open in a Web browser. The very reason why these "previews" exist is so that Mastodon can keep clinging to its purist microblogging principles while at the same time not defacing the posts which are "previewed" with links.

    Also, there must always remain the option to look at messages at their source, and be it stashed away in a menu.

    If you want all of this to disappear just so that phone users are spared from their browsers ever popping up whenever they tap something in their Mastodon apps, then you'll deprive the Mastodon users of any way of seeing anything in the Fediverse without Mastodon's limitations.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Flipboard #Ghost #WordPress #WriteFreely #Plume #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #TextFormatting #RichText
  38. CW: Account getting away with way subpar alt-texts only because it's too niche with too few followers; CW: long (over 1,700 characters), Fediverse meta, alt-text meta, image description meta, character limit meta
    I've just discovered a certain Mastodon account that seems to automatically post images of Second Life avatars. It can be lucky to only have eight followers, one of them being a search engine, the others being Second Life users.

    If it had more follower, it would certainly already have met the wrath of the wider Mastodon community, especially the Mastodon HOA, for breaking Mastodon's unwritten rules.

    And I'm not even talking about nigh-nudity in some of the images with no warning, no image flagging, no hashtag. I'm talking about the alt-texts that are vastly below Mastodon's requirements and quality standards for alt-texts.

    Granted, all things considered, the requirements for good image descriptions by Mastodon's standards have to be extremely hard and tedious to meet, at least by my personal estimations. In fact, they have to be impossible to meet on Mastodon itself due to its tiny character limit, and if this account was somewhere where it could meet these requirements, it'd probably be blocked by loads of Mastodon accounts for its excessively long posts due to the long image descriptions.

    But if more Mastodon users knew it right now, it'd probably be blocked by many more Mastodon accounts than follow it.

    If you post from virtual worlds into the Fediverse, you simply cannot win in the long run. You'll lose either way.

    #SecondLife #Metaverse #VirtualWorld #VirtualWorlds #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #Mastodon #MastodonHOA #MastodonCulture
  39. @Jonathan Kamens 86 47 I don't want to alarm you, but:

    Friendica (https://friendi.ca; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friendica; https://joinfediverse.wiki/Friendica) has introduced full-text search to what would become the Fediverse as early as May, 2010.

    Hubzilla (https://hubzilla.org; https://joinfediverse.wiki/Hubzilla) inherited this feature from Friendica. Hubzilla first came out in March, 2015.

    For reference: Mastodon first came out in January, 2016. It immediately federated with Friendica and Hubzilla. In case you don't believe this: Take a look at my profile on its home server. Does that look like Mastodon?

    The Fediverse has full-text search right now, and it has had full-text search for five years and eight months longer than Mastodon has even existed. This is the status quo.

    If you want your content to be private, don't make it public in the first place.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #FullTextSearch #Privacy
  40. @steve mookie kong ...which, unfortunately, would limit the features of the backend to what Mastodon itself can do. Because nothing else is implemented in the frontend.

    No enclosed threaded conversations. Very limited HTML rendering. No formatting the text of your own messages. No emoji reactions. No images embedded in messages. No more than four images dangling below a message as file attachments.

    If anything, someone who is not a Mastodon dev and not even daily-driving Mastodon should soft-fork Mastodon's Web UI and modify it so that it can adjust to the backend and offer all the features of the backend.

    If you use it with snac2, you have the full set of snac2's features available.

    If you use it with Akkoma, you have the full set of Akkoma's features available.

    If you somehow manage to use it with Friendica, you have the full set of Friendica's features available.

    Maybe there could be some options in the configuration that can (but don't by default) limit certain features to Mastodon's standard for those who really need the Mastodon UX with a non-Mastodon backend.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #snac2 #Akkoma #Friendica #WebInterface
  41. @Dustin @Markus Redeker 🐘 @Elmar Billen Moment, mal langsam.

    Es dürfen nie Informationen ausschließlich im Alt-Text verfügbar sein! Keine Erklärungen und auch sonst nichts.

    Alles an schriftlichen Informationen, was für sehende Menschen nicht aus dem Bild direkt ersichtlich ist, gehört in den Beitragstext.

    Der Grund ist: Es gibt Menschen, die an Alt-Texte nicht herankommen.

    Man braucht ja, um an einen Alt-Text heranzukommen, einen Touchscreen oder so etwas wie eine Maus. Manche Menschen können aber aufgrund körperlicher Behinderungen beides nur schlecht oder gar nicht bedienen, z. B., weil sie einen sehr starken Tremor haben (Parkinson o. ä.) oder gleich überhaupt keine Hände. Trotzdem können sie einen Computer bedienen. Aber sie können eben keine kleine "Alt"-Schaltfläche klicken oder tippen und auch keinen Mauscursor auf ein Bild schieben und ihn da liegenlassen.

    Andere haben selbstauferlegte technische Einschränkungen. Manche Hardcore-Linux-Nutzer haben sich entschieden für einen super-leichtgewichtigen, spartanischen Fenstermanager wie i3wm oder ratpoison, der aber keine Unterstützung für eine Maus hat. Es dürfte aber wohl kein Web-Frontend im Fediverse geben, wo man den Alt-Text eines Bildes mit einem Tastatur-Shortcut öffnen kann.

    Was im Alt-Text steht, können diese Menschen nicht lesen, weil sie den Alt-Text gar nicht erst öffnen können. Das heißt: Informationen, die nur im Alt-Text stehen, sind ihnen verwehrt.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #Bildbeschreibung #Bildbeschreibungen #BildbeschreibungenMeta #CWBildbeschreibungenMeta #Inklusion #Barrierefreiheit
  42. @Dustin Hier bin ich ein bißchen im Zwiespalt.

    Einerseits sagt dir jeder Alt-Text-Guide im Web, daß Alt-Texte kurz und prägnant sein müssen. Andererseits liebt die Mastodon-Kultur aber detaillierte Bildbeschreibungen. So manch einem Mastodon-Nutzer wird das hier zu knapp sein.

    #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #Bildbeschreibung #Bildbeschreibungen #BildbeschreibungenMeta #CWBildbeschreibungenMeta
  43. @knack
    I'd hope, if this happens, that the 'verse can keep 20+ distinct collectives going.

    20+++.

    Mastodon-centric Mastodon mods will never be able to take moderative control over Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte servers. The admins won't let them. Especially (streams) and Forte admins even have counter-measures.

    CC: @:PUA: Shlee booped around &

    #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Moderation
  44. @:PUA: Shlee booped around & This can't work, and for one particular reason. And you should actually know this reason after eight years in the Fediverse:

    The Fediverse is not only Mastodon. It's far from being only Mastodon.

    It isn't 10,000 servers running one application. It's 40,000+ servers running over 150 different applications. And I'm not talking about Mastodon and otherwise Mastodon forks either.

    From your words, I can clearly see that you want the whole Fediverse to be moderated by Mastodon standards.

    But then you have Mastodon mods who are "based and Mastodon-pilled", and for whom the Fediverse either is or shall be only Mastodon. These mods moderate Friendica or Hubzilla or (streams) or Forte servers by Mastodon's standards. Which, by the way, not only clash with the culture on these servers, but even with the technology on these servers. Friendica works a whole lot differently from Mastodon; Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte even more so.

    Oh, and especially Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte don't even have the concept of moderators. I'm absolutely serious here. They don't have Mastodon's concept of reports. Why not? Because they're geared towards self-moderation. Everyone is given the power to moderate their own channels. Unimaginable on Mastodon, also because this involves technologies and features that are unimaginable on Mastodon such as the most advanced permissions systems in the whole Fediverse. Mastodon's culture is about being pampered and coddled. The culture on these three is about self-defence.

    Also: You can't force Mastodon-style Mastodon moderation upon a (streams) server. You can try. But you won't succeed. The server admin won't let you. Again, I'm dead-serious here.

    Unlike on Mastodon, a (streams) admin has various counter-measures available to get rid of your Mastodon mod.
    • They could activate the User Agent Filter and add "mastodon" to the filter list. Bam, all of Mastodon blocked, all present and future servers, in-bound and out-bound.
    • They could activate FedUp which blocks everything that doesn't support enclosed threaded conversations, and Mastodon doesn't, so Mastodon is blocked, too.
    • If everything else fails, they could turn ActivityPub support off for the whole server, thus cutting everything off that isn't (streams) or Hubzilla. (This, by the way, is even available to individual users.)

    Stuff like this, by the way, Mastodon forcing its culture upon the non-Mastodon Fediverse, is the very reason why (streams) and Forte have built-in ways to defend themselves against Mastodon. And this is one reason why Hubzilla sticks to ActivityPub being optional on each channel.

    Back to the Mastodon mods. They'll probably only know Mastodon. More importantly, they probably won't know anything about groups. They'll probably think the Fediverse doesn't even have groups. They'll only know users following other users.

    And then they'll have to moderate on Lemmy. They'll have to moderate a group. Something they didn't even expect to exist. In a place where users can't follow other users, only subscribe to groups, because it's essentially a Reddit clone.

    Worse yet, they'll have to moderate a Lemmy community with 10,000 members. All of whom are former Redditors. All of whom live by a culture that's directly derived from Reddit with no influence from Twitter or Mastodon at all. None of whom have ever been on Twitter or Mastodon. Almost none of whom even know that Mastodon exists. And many of whom have their experiences with power-tripping Lemmy moderators, so if you think they're easy to rein in with a culture that isn't theirs, you're very wrong.

    (Greetings from Hubzilla.)

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #NotOnlyMastodon #FediverseIsNotMastodon #MastodonIsNotTheFediverse #Mastodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Lemmy #Groups #FediGroups #FediverseGroups #Moderation #MastodonCulture #MastodonCentricity #MastodonNormativity
  45. @Mark Andrew 🇨🇭 I guess that, more often than not, the only new developments that are widely welcome are those that happen on Mastodon, that still don't make Mastodon feel different, and that don't introduce features to Mastodon that are (considered) bad on 𝕏.

    This alone is the reason why many Mastodon admins hold on to older Mastodon versions for their dear lives: They want to boycott new Mastodon features which they don't like, but they don't have what it takes to soft-fork or even only hard-fork Mastodon and remove the new features.

    Now, when it comes to developments in the Fediverse outside of Mastodon, they tend to be even more nerve-grating for Mastodon users because they often aren't in line with Mastodon and its culture at all. That is, many Mastodon users don't even notice that these features exist unless these features directly hit their timeline. But once they do, they're considered bad new developments even though they've actually been around for much longer than Mastodon itself.

    For example, quote-posts and full-text search. Mastodon users tend to be staunchly against both because they're used to harass and dogpile minorities on 𝕏. If at all, they're only okay with these if they come with an opt-in, and/or if server admins can turn them off entirely.

    If only they knew that Friendica has had both since May, 2010, five years and eight months longer than Mastodon has even existed. That Friendica has been search-indexing and able to quote-post any public Mastodon toot since Mastodon's very launch. I guess they'd demand the immediate destruction of Friendica or at least its complete and permanent defederation.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate #FullTextSearch #Mastodon #Friendica
  46. @Leave X - Protect Democracy Tell that to those who are hostile even towards non-Mastodon Fediverse users because they don't act precisely like Mastodon users (or like Mastodon users are supposed to act), and because they refuse to adopt Mastodon's culture.

    #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #MastodonCulture #MastodonCentricity #MastodonNormativity
  47. @Jakub Urbanowicz So I guess this change should be proposed to (streams) and Forte.

    As I've said, the *keys fail rather ungracefully as they're caught off-guard.

    #FediMeta #FediMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Sharkey
  48. CW: Mentions and hashtags on Hubzilla are more "normal" in version 11.4, and this probably isn't pandering to Mastodon; CW: long (over 3,200 characters), Fediverse meta, Fediverse-beyond-Mastodon meta, hashtag meta
    I've noticed that Hubzilla 11.4 handles mentions and hashtags (closer to) the Twitter way instead of the Identi.ca way now. The @ and the # became part of the link (@Jupiter's Fedi-Memes on (streams), #Hashtag, for example).

    I wouldn't cry out "pandering to Mastodon" now. I don't think this happened in the same vein as Forte giving the choice between starting an enclosed conversation and starting a microblogging-style loose thread. After all, it's vanilla Mastodon out of all microblogging applications that handles the old Identi.ca way quite gracefully. And even what didn't work as intended didn't cause a big mess instead either.

    Other Fediverse applications are way less prepared for this. From the Mastodon fork Glitch to all the *keys and, I think, the *omas, not only can't they handle the Identi.ca way, but they tend to fail rather ungracefully because they don't even expect anything else than the Twitter way. Especially on Misskey, this has been recognised as a bug in 2024 already, and nothing much has happened in terms of fixing it. Of course, all the Forkeys have inherited the bug, and I think none of them has fixed it instead of waiting for upstream Misskey to fix it. I'm not even sure if Iceshrimp.NET, a complete rewrite in C#, hasn't re-implemented it.

    I mean, if lots of Fediverse server applications render Hubzilla's old "#Hashtag" (with the number sign outside the link, the Identi.ca way) as its Markdown representation, "#[Hashtag](https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hashtag)", and people keep complaining, then someone has to step in and put an end to this mess. And lots of fingers were pointing at Hubzilla. While tens of thousands of Mastodon accounts blocked Hubzilla channels for their long posts, hundreds of *key accounts blocked Hubzilla channels for how completely messed up their hashtags came out.

    Also, unless I'm completely wrong, the first Fediverse server application that handled mentions and hashtags the Twitter way rather than the Identi.ca way wasn't Mastodon either; it was GNU social, itself a fork of StatusNet, the software that used to power Identi.ca before its switch to pump.io.

    So this wasn't a case of Hubzilla acting up on Mastodon. It was a case of Hubzilla acting up across at least half the Fediverse, Mastodon actually largely excluded.

    That is, it may still worry you that Hubzilla whose foundation was laid in May, 2012, based on Friendica which is another two years older, adapted to software which came later instead of playing the "we were here first" card. A whole lot of software which came later and which was largely created independently from Mastodon (although both Mastodon and Pleroma started their lives as something akin to alternative frontends for GNU social), but still.

    By the way, don't Friendica, (streams) and Forte still cause the same issue? Especially Forte that has actually started pandering to Mastodon as of late?

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #GlitchSoc #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Hubzilla11 #Hashtags #HashtagMeta #CWHashtagMeta #Mention #Mentions #MentionTag
  49. @Tyler Sticka @Old Man Vandehey @Neatnik :prami: I have a problem with this. But I probably only have this problem because whenever I post an image, it's about an extremely obscure niche topic. (Don't go looking for my recent images on this channel; I post my images elsewhere and even there only recently.)

    When you're describing an image to a friend, first of all, you're describing the image to only one person. You probably already know that person. You can at least estimate what they know about the image you're going to describe. If not, you can ask them what they know, what they don't know, what they need to know, what they want to know.

    And then you can tailor your description to the individual wants and needs of that one specific person. And you can add the explanations which this person needs and omit the explanations which this person doesn't need.

    In case they don't understand something, or if they want to know more details, they can interrupt you mid-describing and ask you.

    But when you're describing an image for the Fediverse, you're describing it for potentionally everyone in the Fediverse (and everyone on the Web, unless you restrict the permission to view your post). You don't know all these people, there's no way you can.

    You simply can't go around and ask millions of Fediverse users and billions of Web users, one by one, what they know about the topic of your image, what they don't know etc. Neither can you predict who exactly will receive your post and then only go and ask these people in advance.

    Even if you could, you can't tailor your image description and accompanying explanations to the individual needs of many people. Especially not if you're going to post that image only once for everyone all the same.

    Worse yet, they can't interrupt you mid-describing and ask you for explanations either. They'll get the entire description plus your explanations all at once.

    Thus, you have to describe and explain your image for everyone all the same with no regards for individual needs. You have to cover everyone's potential needs right away.

    Let's take (link CW: eye contact, meme, non-Mastodon Fediverse meta) this image, for example. I've actually used it in a Fediverse meme post.

    If I were to describe it to one friend, I'd ask the friend if they're familiar with the "One Does Not Simply Walk Into Mordor" meme template, and if they're familiar with FEP-ef61 "Portable Objects". Honestly, I expect hardly anyone to know both.

    If they aren't familiar with FEP-ef61, and they most likely aren't, I'd ask them if they know nomadic identity, and if they know the streams repository, because knowing both is required for my explanation of FEP-ef61. They probably don't know either, so I'd explain the streams repository to them, including rattling down the whole 16-year history of the software family from Mistpark/Friendica to Forte. When I reach the rewriting of Red in 2012, I'd explain the concept of nomadic identity because it was then when it was first implemented. And even that I could only do if they knew the Fediverse. If not, I'd go start with the Fediverse.

    If they aren't familiar with "One Does Not Simply Walk Into Mordor", I'd ask them if I could send them a link to the KnowYourMeme page, or if they need it described by me. If the latter, I'd ask them if they're familiar with the concepts of snowclones and image macros. And so forth. Whatever they aren't familiar with, I'd explain it to them.

    As for the visuals, I'd ask them if they need a visual description of what Boromir looks like, regardless of whether or not this matters in the context. I'd also ask them how familiar they are with The Lord of the Rings and specifically the Peter Jackson films. For this may require even more explanations.

    How am I supposed to do any of this with an audience of many? Right, I can't.

    And so I have to deliver all necessary explanations in the message text, right beneath the image itself, just in case someone needs them. And let's face it, most people will need them. The explanation of the image macro itself plus another eight explanations in order for people to understand the main explanation. Over 25,000 characters if they consider links to external explanations bad.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta
  50. @Kiloku - Secretário do Caos @Neatnik :prami: I've been working on an entire wiki about image descriptions and alt-texts for the Fediverse for quite a while now. It's far from finished, not even half of the over 50 pages planned right now are written.

    As of now, it'll have 32 rules and guidelines on what to do, how to do it and what not to do. The huge majority of these are completely unknown in the Fediverse otherwise.

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta
  51. @Chao-c'
    BTW I had account on identi.ca, which was StatusNet powered (I believe).

    It was. At least until Evan and Erin could no longer justify it running on that janky OStatus protocol. The result was the ActivityPump protocol, the pump.io software and Identi.ca's switch to pump.io with all hands on board.

    Yes, and it should not be implemented in Ruby or PHP or something like that. I have seen one online discussion forum being rewritten from PHP to Rust few years ago, and the improvement in responsiveness of the web platform was amazing. (I do C, not Rust, but C is too oldschool now, and the performance penalty of Rust is minor, probably not noticeable at all)

    This reminds me of how the Fediverse is all over the place in terms of programming languages. Everyone has their own Holy Grail.

    Friendica and its descendants are written in PHP. They may not be the fastest (even though what bogged down early Friendica were its heavyweight federation connectors to everywhere, especially the one for Facebook that came in 2011). Mike either discarded or rewrote these when he rewrote Red. But they happily run on a run-of-the-mill LAMP stack.

    Mastodon is written in Ruby on Rails. Hubzilla runs circles around it in terms of performance per account/channel, and that has to say something. The only thing that managed to top this was early diaspora*, written in Ruby on Rails for Mac with MongoDB as the database system.

    The *omas are built in Elixir. Granted, they're utter featherweights, especially considering their features. They're legendary for their low server impact. Then again, Pleroma apparently is spaghetti code straight from hell. Its own devs often don't have a clue where to go look for bugs, much less how to fix them. (Miraculously, the Akkoma devs do manage to get ride of quite a number of them.)

    The *keys are built in TypeScript and Vue.js. I guess one reason why Misskey is infamous for having so many forks and forks of forks is because there are tons of people who can code in JavaScript, the primary mobile programming language.

    Iceshrimp.NET is a still very incomplete "rewrite" of old Iceshrimp in C#. It was largely tackled to get rid of all those nasty bugs inherited from Misskey that even Misskey doesn't manage to get rid of. I've heard quite some outcry: Iceshrimp.NET is a sell-out to Microsoft. I guess whoever uttered that didn't go check who owns TypeScript.

    PieFed is a dead giveaway: Python. And PieFed makes more headlines in the Threadiverse for server politics than for its underlying technology, except that Lemmy pales in comparison.

    GoToSocial is a dead giveaway, too: Go. And it was one of the first Fediverse server applications to not come with a Web UI. Those who use it for a single-user server often don't even bother installing one and use some Mastodon app or other instead. Besides, why drag around a Web UI if there are much better third-party Web UIs than whatever you could whip up?

    #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Iceshrimp #IceshrimpJS #Iceshrimp.NET #PieFed #GoToSocial #PHP #RubyOnRails #Elixir #JavaScript #TypeScript #VueJS #C# #Python #Go
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