#bootstrappable — Public Fediverse posts

Had a most lovely---almost 2h---video chat session with @ekaitz_zarraga and Timothy Sample (GNU Mes contributor and author of Germ) on the workings of Ekaitz' rewrite of Mes from a Scheme interpreter to a compiler.

AIUI, Guile Scheme has some interesting characteristics that prevent the Mes compiler from using some simple and low hanging fruit performance improvements. Sorry for being vague, Ekaitz can elaborate.

Wondering if these are also "slowing down" Guile so much---and if not, why not?---and if anything could be done about that.

#GNU
#Guile
#Guix
#Mes
#bootstrappable
#fullSourceBootstrap
@civodul
@wingo
@reproducible_builds
@nlnet
@guix

Had a most lovely---almost 2h---video chat session with @ekaitz_zarraga and Timothy Sample (GNU Mes contributor and author of Germ) on the workings of Ekaitz' rewrite of Mes from a Scheme interpreter to a compiler.

AIUI, Guile Scheme has some interesting characteristics that prevent the Mes compiler from using some simple and low hanging fruit performance improvements. Sorry for being vague, Ekaitz can elaborate.

Wondering if these are also "slowing down" Guile so much---and if not, why not?---and if anything could be done about that.

#GNU
#Guile
#Guix
#Mes
#bootstrappable
#fullSourceBootstrap
@civodul
@wingo
@reproducible_builds
@nlnet
@guix

Had a most lovely---almost 2h---video chat session with @ekaitz_zarraga and Timothy Sample (GNU Mes contributor and author of Germ) on the workings of Ekaitz' rewrite of Mes from a Scheme interpreter to a compiler.

AIUI, Guile Scheme has some interesting characteristics that prevent the Mes compiler from using some simple and low hanging fruit performance improvements. Sorry for being vague, Ekaitz can elaborate.

Wondering if these are also "slowing down" Guile so much---and if not, why not?---and if anything could be done about that.

#GNU
#Guile
#Guix
#Mes
#bootstrappable
#fullSourceBootstrap
@civodul
@wingo
@reproducible_builds
@nlnet
@guix

Had a most lovely---almost 2h---video chat session with @ekaitz_zarraga and Timothy Sample (GNU Mes contributor and author of Germ) on the workings of Ekaitz' rewrite of Mes from a Scheme interpreter to a compiler.

AIUI, Guile Scheme has some interesting characteristics that prevent the Mes compiler from using some simple and low hanging fruit performance improvements. Sorry for being vague, Ekaitz can elaborate.

Wondering if these are also "slowing down" Guile so much---and if not, why not?---and if anything could be done about that.

#GNU
#Guile
#Guix
#Mes
#bootstrappable
#fullSourceBootstrap
@civodul
@wingo
@reproducible_builds
@nlnet
@guix

Had a most lovely---almost 2h---video chat session with @ekaitz_zarraga and Timothy Sample (GNU Mes contributor and author of Germ) on the workings of Ekaitz' rewrite of Mes from a Scheme interpreter to a compiler.

AIUI, Guile Scheme has some interesting characteristics that prevent the Mes compiler from using some simple and low hanging fruit performance improvements. Sorry for being vague, Ekaitz can elaborate.

Wondering if these are also "slowing down" Guile so much---and if not, why not?---and if anything could be done about that.

#GNU
#Guile
#Guix
#Mes
#bootstrappable
#fullSourceBootstrap
@civodul
@wingo
@reproducible_builds
@nlnet
@guix

I take that back, a (ideally #bootstrappable) #reproducible declaratively defined OS distribution like #guix is the best means to maintain a global perspective of your OS. But unless you are a minimal uptime warrior that keeps everything in a /tmp-like directory that is flushed on shutdown, you still need email to keep track with whats going on! (and you can't convince me that setting up prometheus compares to working directly with the plumbing! at least for monolithic desktop user systems)

I take that back, a (ideally #bootstrappable) #reproducible declaratively defined OS distribution like #guix is the best means to maintain a global perspective of your OS. But unless you are a minimal uptime warrior that keeps everything in a /tmp-like directory that is flushed on shutdown, you still need email to keep track with whats going on! (and you can't convince me that setting up prometheus compares to working directly with the plumbing! at least for monolithic desktop user systems)

I take that back, a (ideally #bootstrappable) #reproducible declaratively defined OS distribution like #guix is the best means to maintain a global perspective of your OS. But unless you are a minimal uptime warrior that keeps everything in a /tmp-like directory that is flushed on shutdown, you still need email to keep track with whats going on! (and you can't convince me that setting up prometheus compares to working directly with the plumbing! at least for monolithic desktop user systems)

I take that back, a (ideally #bootstrappable) #reproducible declaratively defined OS distribution like #guix is the best means to maintain a global perspective of your OS. But unless you are a minimal uptime warrior that keeps everything in a /tmp-like directory that is flushed on shutdown, you still need email to keep track with whats going on! (and you can't convince me that setting up prometheus compares to working directly with the plumbing! at least for monolithic desktop user systems)

I take that back, a (ideally #bootstrappable) #reproducible declaratively defined OS distribution like #guix is the best means to maintain a global perspective of your OS. But unless you are a minimal uptime warrior that keeps everything in a /tmp-like directory that is flushed on shutdown, you still need email to keep track with whats going on! (and you can't convince me that setting up prometheus compares to working directly with the plumbing! at least for monolithic desktop user systems)

@regtur
Wait what? #GNU #Mes isn't being mentioned? Not even in the comments?
Fediverse do your thing!

cc: @lauriewired @reproducible_builds
@guix
@ekaitz_zarraga
@nlnet #bootstrappable
#bootstrappablebuilds
#guix
#trustingtrust

@regtur
Wait what? #GNU #Mes isn't being mentioned? Not even in the comments?
Fediverse do your thing!

cc: @lauriewired @reproducible_builds
@guix
@ekaitz_zarraga
@nlnet #bootstrappable
#bootstrappablebuilds
#guix
#trustingtrust

@regtur
Wait what? #GNU #Mes isn't being mentioned? Not even in the comments?
Fediverse do your thing!

cc: @lauriewired @reproducible_builds
@guix
@ekaitz_zarraga
@nlnet #bootstrappable
#bootstrappablebuilds
#guix
#trustingtrust

@regtur
Wait what? #GNU #Mes isn't being mentioned? Not even in the comments?
Fediverse do your thing!

cc: @lauriewired @reproducible_builds
@guix
@ekaitz_zarraga
@nlnet #bootstrappable
#bootstrappablebuilds
#guix
#trustingtrust

@regtur
Wait what? #GNU #Mes isn't being mentioned? Not even in the comments?
Fediverse do your thing!

cc: @lauriewired @reproducible_builds
@guix
@ekaitz_zarraga
@nlnet #bootstrappable
#bootstrappablebuilds
#guix
#trustingtrust

@khinsen @pjotrprins @zimoun
The concept of bootstrappability, the hard felt importance to be able to build (and bootstrap) your binaries from source, could help with that (think #supplychainsecurity )

Our #bootstrappable movement is slowly growing, sadly its still quite small.
Cc: @reproducible_builds

@khinsen @pjotrprins @zimoun
The concept of bootstrappability, the hard felt importance to be able to build (and bootstrap) your binaries from source, could help with that (think #supplychainsecurity )

Our #bootstrappable movement is slowly growing, sadly its still quite small.
Cc: @reproducible_builds

@khinsen @pjotrprins @zimoun
The concept of bootstrappability, the hard felt importance to be able to build (and bootstrap) your binaries from source, could help with that (think #supplychainsecurity )

Our #bootstrappable movement is slowly growing, sadly its still quite small.
Cc: @reproducible_builds

@khinsen @pjotrprins @zimoun
The concept of bootstrappability, the hard felt importance to be able to build (and bootstrap) your binaries from source, could help with that (think #supplychainsecurity )

Our #bootstrappable movement is slowly growing, sadly its still quite small.
Cc: @reproducible_builds

@khinsen @pjotrprins @zimoun
The concept of bootstrappability, the hard felt importance to be able to build (and bootstrap) your binaries from source, could help with that (think #supplychainsecurity )

Our #bootstrappable movement is slowly growing, sadly its still quite small.
Cc: @reproducible_builds

#GNU Mes 0.27.1 released: A bug-fix release that supports

* development build with gcc-14
* building with M2-Planet 1.12.0
* building on x86-linux with M2-Planet 1.13.0
* building bootstrappable-tcc using 1.00.02 <= NYACC <= 2.02.2

<https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/info-gnu/2025-08/msg00005.html>

Thanks to @ekaitz_zarraga and @stikonas!

#GnuMes
#bootstrappable
#BootstrappableBuilds
#ReproducibleBuilds
@reproducible_builds
@fsf
@fsfe
@gnutools
@nlnet

#GNU Mes 0.27.1 released: A bug-fix release that supports

* development build with gcc-14
* building with M2-Planet 1.12.0
* building on x86-linux with M2-Planet 1.13.0
* building bootstrappable-tcc using 1.00.02 <= NYACC <= 2.02.2

<https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/info-gnu/2025-08/msg00005.html>

Thanks to @ekaitz_zarraga and @stikonas!

#GnuMes
#bootstrappable
#BootstrappableBuilds
#ReproducibleBuilds
@reproducible_builds
@fsf
@fsfe
@gnutools
@nlnet

#GNU Mes 0.27.1 released: A bug-fix release that supports

* development build with gcc-14
* building with M2-Planet 1.12.0
* building on x86-linux with M2-Planet 1.13.0
* building bootstrappable-tcc using 1.00.02 <= NYACC <= 2.02.2

<https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/info-gnu/2025-08/msg00005.html>

Thanks to @ekaitz_zarraga and @stikonas!

#GnuMes
#bootstrappable
#BootstrappableBuilds
#ReproducibleBuilds
@reproducible_builds
@fsf
@fsfe
@gnutools
@nlnet

#GNU Mes 0.27.1 released: A bug-fix release that supports

* development build with gcc-14
* building with M2-Planet 1.12.0
* building on x86-linux with M2-Planet 1.13.0
* building bootstrappable-tcc using 1.00.02 <= NYACC <= 2.02.2

<https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/info-gnu/2025-08/msg00005.html>

Thanks to @ekaitz_zarraga and @stikonas!

#GnuMes
#bootstrappable
#BootstrappableBuilds
#ReproducibleBuilds
@reproducible_builds
@fsf
@fsfe
@gnutools
@nlnet

#GNU Mes 0.27.1 released: A bug-fix release that supports

* development build with gcc-14
* building with M2-Planet 1.12.0
* building on x86-linux with M2-Planet 1.13.0
* building bootstrappable-tcc using 1.00.02 <= NYACC <= 2.02.2

<https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/info-gnu/2025-08/msg00005.html>

Thanks to @ekaitz_zarraga and @stikonas!

#GnuMes
#bootstrappable
#BootstrappableBuilds
#ReproducibleBuilds
@reproducible_builds
@fsf
@fsfe
@gnutools
@nlnet

@aemogie @marmar22 it triggered me to read it and it's pretty detailed indeed. What I miss most is the #bootstrappable effort that #Guix started and implemented, or maybe a broader list of values that would set Guix apart.

@aemogie @marmar22 it triggered me to read it and it's pretty detailed indeed. What I miss most is the #bootstrappable effort that #Guix started and implemented, or maybe a broader list of values that would set Guix apart.

@aemogie @marmar22 it triggered me to read it and it's pretty detailed indeed. What I miss most is the #bootstrappable effort that #Guix started and implemented, or maybe a broader list of values that would set Guix apart.

@aemogie @marmar22 it triggered me to read it and it's pretty detailed indeed. What I miss most is the #bootstrappable effort that #Guix started and implemented, or maybe a broader list of values that would set Guix apart.

@aemogie @marmar22 it triggered me to read it and it's pretty detailed indeed. What I miss most is the #bootstrappable effort that #Guix started and implemented, or maybe a broader list of values that would set Guix apart.

Good and bad #bootstrapping and #lisp news.
Timothy Sample has been exploring to write a #bootstrappable syntax-case implementation (the first?) and using GNU Mes to prototype that, sponsored by @nlnet .

Sadly, it didn't perform and #NLnet apparently didn't choose to extend his grant. (Boo!)

Edit: I was contacted by NLnet and they convinced me that they never denied such an extension (or new grant) proposal.
So...that's probably double sad...this seems to have been a most classical communication problem (seen Black Mirror S07E05?).

Edit: Also, the "Boo!" was primarily directed at the possibility of the EU retracting funding, NLnet is doing very important work, and amazingly so.

Anyway, Timothy is now writing another bootstrappable lisp implementation: Germ. It's still pretty early days but it's looking great. So happy with this!

https://ngyro.com/blog/introducing-germ-lisp.html

Good and bad #bootstrapping and #lisp news.
Timothy Sample has been exploring to write a #bootstrappable syntax-case implementation (the first?) and using GNU Mes to prototype that, sponsored by @nlnet .

Sadly, it didn't perform and #NLnet apparently didn't choose to extend his grant. (Boo!)

Edit: I was contacted by NLnet and they convinced me that they never denied such an extension (or new grant) proposal.
So...that's probably double sad...this seems to have been a most classical communication problem (seen Black Mirror S07E05?).

Edit: Also, the "Boo!" was primarily directed at the possibility of the EU retracting funding, NLnet is doing very important work, and amazingly so.

Anyway, Timothy is now writing another bootstrappable lisp implementation: Germ. It's still pretty early days but it's looking great. So happy with this!

https://ngyro.com/blog/introducing-germ-lisp.html

Good and bad #bootstrapping and #lisp news.
Timothy Sample has been exploring to write a #bootstrappable syntax-case implementation (the first?) and using GNU Mes to prototype that, sponsored by @nlnet .

Sadly, it didn't perform and #NLnet apparently didn't choose to extend his grant. (Boo!)

Edit: I was contacted by NLnet and they convinced me that they never denied such an extension (or new grant) proposal.
So...that's probably double sad...this seems to have been a most classical communication problem (seen Black Mirror S07E05?).

Edit: Also, the "Boo!" was primarily directed at the possibility of the EU retracting funding, NLnet is doing very important work, and amazingly so.

Anyway, Timothy is now writing another bootstrappable lisp implementation: Germ. It's still pretty early days but it's looking great. So happy with this!

https://ngyro.com/blog/introducing-germ-lisp.html

Good and bad #bootstrapping and #lisp news.
Timothy Sample has been exploring to write a #bootstrappable syntax-case implementation (the first?) and using GNU Mes to prototype that, sponsored by @nlnet .

Sadly, it didn't perform and #NLnet apparently didn't choose to extend his grant. (Boo!)

Edit: I was contacted by NLnet and they convinced me that they never denied such an extension (or new grant) proposal.
So...that's probably double sad...this seems to have been a most classical communication problem (seen Black Mirror S07E05?).

Edit: Also, the "Boo!" was primarily directed at the possibility of the EU retracting funding, NLnet is doing very important work, and amazingly so.

Anyway, Timothy is now writing another bootstrappable lisp implementation: Germ. It's still pretty early days but it's looking great. So happy with this!

https://ngyro.com/blog/introducing-germ-lisp.html

Good and bad #bootstrapping and #lisp news.
Timothy Sample has been exploring to write a #bootstrappable syntax-case implementation (the first?) and using GNU Mes to prototype that, sponsored by @nlnet .

Sadly, it didn't perform and #NLnet apparently didn't choose to extend his grant. (Boo!)

Edit: I was contacted by NLnet and they convinced me that they never denied such an extension (or new grant) proposal.
So...that's probably double sad...this seems to have been a most classical communication problem (seen Black Mirror S07E05?).

Edit: Also, the "Boo!" was primarily directed at the possibility of the EU retracting funding, NLnet is doing very important work, and amazingly so.

Anyway, Timothy is now writing another bootstrappable lisp implementation: Germ. It's still pretty early days but it's looking great. So happy with this!

https://ngyro.com/blog/introducing-germ-lisp.html

gccrs: An alternative compiler for Rust relying on GNU Compiler Collection (GCC)

« Maybe more importantly however, there is a number of things that gccrs is NOT for. The project has multiple explicit non-goals, which we value just as highly as our goals. »

Missing the goal of a better #bootstrappable Rust, no?

Currently more or less a long chain…

https://guix.gnu.org/en/blog/2018/bootstrapping-rust

https://blog.rust-lang.org/2024/11/07/gccrs-an-alternative-compiler-for-rust.html

gccrs: An alternative compiler for Rust relying on GNU Compiler Collection (GCC)

« Maybe more importantly however, there is a number of things that gccrs is NOT for. The project has multiple explicit non-goals, which we value just as highly as our goals. »

Missing the goal of a better #bootstrappable Rust, no?

Currently more or less a long chain…

https://guix.gnu.org/en/blog/2018/bootstrapping-rust

https://blog.rust-lang.org/2024/11/07/gccrs-an-alternative-compiler-for-rust.html

gccrs: An alternative compiler for Rust relying on GNU Compiler Collection (GCC)

« Maybe more importantly however, there is a number of things that gccrs is NOT for. The project has multiple explicit non-goals, which we value just as highly as our goals. »

Missing the goal of a better #bootstrappable Rust, no?

Currently more or less a long chain…

https://guix.gnu.org/en/blog/2018/bootstrapping-rust

https://blog.rust-lang.org/2024/11/07/gccrs-an-alternative-compiler-for-rust.html

gccrs: An alternative compiler for Rust relying on GNU Compiler Collection (GCC)

« Maybe more importantly however, there is a number of things that gccrs is NOT for. The project has multiple explicit non-goals, which we value just as highly as our goals. »

Missing the goal of a better #bootstrappable Rust, no?

Currently more or less a long chain…

https://guix.gnu.org/en/blog/2018/bootstrapping-rust

https://blog.rust-lang.org/2024/11/07/gccrs-an-alternative-compiler-for-rust.html

gccrs: An alternative compiler for Rust relying on GNU Compiler Collection (GCC)

« Maybe more importantly however, there is a number of things that gccrs is NOT for. The project has multiple explicit non-goals, which we value just as highly as our goals. »

Missing the goal of a better #bootstrappable Rust, no?

Currently more or less a long chain…

https://guix.gnu.org/en/blog/2018/bootstrapping-rust

https://blog.rust-lang.org/2024/11/07/gccrs-an-alternative-compiler-for-rust.html

Wanted to share that [Stageˣ] is now full source bootstrapped, 100% reproducible, signed by 2-3 independent reviewers/reproducers on every release, and can build itself.

It can be the base of reproducible build containers for most projects written in c, c++, nodejs, go, php, ocaml, rust, or zig.

I am thankful for the efforts of our team, and the patient advice and tireless debugging of people in the #reproducible-builds and #bootstrappable projects <3

https://codeberg.org/stagex/stagex

Wanted to share that [Stageˣ] is now full source bootstrapped, 100% reproducible, signed by 2-3 independent reviewers/reproducers on every release, and can build itself.

It can be the base of reproducible build containers for most projects written in c, c++, nodejs, go, php, ocaml, rust, or zig.

I am thankful for the efforts of our team, and the patient advice and tireless debugging of people in the #reproducible-builds and #bootstrappable projects <3

https://codeberg.org/stagex/stagex

Wanted to share that [Stageˣ] is now full source bootstrapped, 100% reproducible, signed by 2-3 independent reviewers/reproducers on every release, and can build itself.

It can be the base of reproducible build containers for most projects written in c, c++, nodejs, go, php, ocaml, rust, or zig.

I am thankful for the efforts of our team, and the patient advice and tireless debugging of people in the #reproducible-builds and #bootstrappable projects <3

https://codeberg.org/stagex/stagex

Wanted to share that [Stageˣ] is now full source bootstrapped, 100% reproducible, signed by 2-3 independent reviewers/reproducers on every release, and can build itself.

It can be the base of reproducible build containers for most projects written in c, c++, nodejs, go, php, ocaml, rust, or zig.

I am thankful for the efforts of our team, and the patient advice and tireless debugging of people in the #reproducible-builds and #bootstrappable projects <3

https://codeberg.org/stagex/stagex

Wanted to share that [Stageˣ] is now full source bootstrapped, 100% reproducible, signed by 2-3 independent reviewers/reproducers on every release, and can build itself.

It can be the base of reproducible build containers for most projects written in c, c++, nodejs, go, php, ocaml, rust, or zig.

I am thankful for the efforts of our team, and the patient advice and tireless debugging of people in the #reproducible-builds and #bootstrappable projects <3

https://codeberg.org/stagex/stagex

@mgorny since you complained about source code containing time bombs the other day, and I couldn't believe anyone sane would do that, here's openjdk9 refusing to compile because of "outdated" currency data (I'm trying to bootstrap #java ).

#bootstrappable #compilation #software

@mgorny since you complained about source code containing time bombs the other day, and I couldn't believe anyone sane would do that, here's openjdk9 refusing to compile because of "outdated" currency data (I'm trying to bootstrap #java ).

#bootstrappable #compilation #software

@mgorny since you complained about source code containing time bombs the other day, and I couldn't believe anyone sane would do that, here's openjdk9 refusing to compile because of "outdated" currency data (I'm trying to bootstrap #java ).

#bootstrappable #compilation #software

@mgorny since you complained about source code containing time bombs the other day, and I couldn't believe anyone sane would do that, here's openjdk9 refusing to compile because of "outdated" currency data (I'm trying to bootstrap #java ).

#bootstrappable #compilation #software

@mgorny since you complained about source code containing time bombs the other day, and I couldn't believe anyone sane would do that, here's openjdk9 refusing to compile because of "outdated" currency data (I'm trying to bootstrap #java ).

#bootstrappable #compilation #software